Virgin twin cousins...is there hope?

[Boris Godunov]

In all seriousness, their miserable track record with woman + the copious amounts of porn leads me to believe they have a really bad attitude towards women that needs to change. You say they aren't interested in trampy girls, but then they watch all this porn... cognitive dissonance?

Do they have any good female friends, or do they only consort with guys? I ask this, because it seems their relationships with women is now in the realm of the dysfunctional. It sounds like they objectify women to an extreme, either as unattainable idols of perfection or as harlots not worthy of their interest (but still worthy of their viewing attention...).

[Traianvs]

blah, easy just get them girls that are just as shy as they are... it's like, beautiful people usually don't go out with ugly people, same here, talkative people with calm people doesn't work

it'll loosen up after they get to know eachother a bit better anyway...






PS: I wouldn't have a clue, I'm in the same situation, except that i'm 10 years younger and not desperate as sex is just as appealing to me as $hitting.. I prefer friendly contacts instead => drinking tons of beer, and playing computer games!!

[Dis]

If you're ever in Nevada I can hook them up

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Spec
I tried matching them up with douzens of girls without succes, they always f**k up somewhere.

To hazard a guess, Spec, you have been matching them up with the wrong kinds of women. Seeing that your character is rather different from your cousins, and that these women are probably your friends (or friends' friends), that seems to be the problem.

However, if it's not a character mismatch, it's only that they have a problem talking with women, perhaps you can try to have them talk with women over ICQ or something. Just make sure that they don't know they are talking to women, so they can be more of themselves.

[Ted Striker]

Urban Ranger is pretty good with this stuff. I'd listen to him...

[Space05us]

have they ever actually talkd to a female, like actually held a conversation? maybe they should go talk to ma and sis and ask for advice, and if they think they're above that then theres no hope.

[Dis]

In any case I'm not a good person to ask. I can get dates, but I still struggle talking to women.

My expertise is whores and mail order brides .

[Ted Striker]

[muxec]

And even more: do they speak the same language that females do? Maybe they speak Chinese, Spainish or Hebrew?

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Ted Striker
Urban Ranger is pretty good with this stuff. I'd listen to him...

Com'on, you're the True Player around here.

[Spec]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
However, if it's not a character mismatch, it's only that they have a problem talking with women, perhaps you can try to have them talk with women over ICQ or something. Just make sure that they don't know they are talking to women, so they can be more of themselves.

Good idea man! I hadn't thought of that. I'll give it a try and let you know.

Thanks man.

Dissident, I would never doubt that your expertise are in that area, somehow, I just knew.

Spec.

[Az]

actually i hear israeli girls are known for they ability to suck golf balls through hoses

I wish.

Spec, If all fails, you can hire Escorts for them, unknowingly, and order them to behave like regular women, but be a bit more... open.

I think I'd order one for my kid, if he had such trouble. esp. in teen age. releases so much of the teenage pressure.

[Spiffor]

I have been a virgin/girlfriendless for a very long time, even though not as old as your cousins. I grew resignated to the point of thinking I would never have any girlfriend (not desperate for sex though). However, most of my friends worried about that, and there have been talks of giving me a hooker for my birthday since I have been 16. I never accepted, because I have sweared I wouldn't unvirgin myself (erm, what the word for dépuceler ?) with a professional.

I agree with Kroptokin here. Their desperation to get sex make them believe there is a huge stake whenever they date a woman. This is the main cause of their gaffes. They have to learn how to talk casually with women, and as such they have to encounter them outside dates, they have to talk to them without even thinking of sex. They have to talk to female acquaintances ca. the same way as they would talk to male acquaintances.

It is easier said than done. But it is needed in order to end their communication problem. The mere fact that they can talk casually with women should help giving them enough self-confidence for the next dates.

However, there is a risk associated to it : they can give the impression of being "friends" systematically. I mean, they can look like people who have no interest in women and sex. Hence, women won't think of them as potential lovers at all. This impression can be easily dispelled if they obviously hit on a woman at some social gathering. Even if they fail, it'll be a reminder to all that they are male as well.

[Az]

There is a problem though, spiff. of course, you can say: "who cares?". but what if you have real strong feeling for a girl? If you go after her, most chances are you'll blow it, and that will leave your heart aching. Or, you can try and "practice" on other girls, but then, you'll do relationships "for practice", and, in essense, behave like a real bastard to those women.

God I hate the game.

[muxec]

Ni, Spec, I dont think that it's the good idea. Online sex is not the same thing. I know a girl who just for fun copulated via internet with somebody in Australia (She is in USA). I think that online sex is even dangerous.

You know, there is a special device for online sex. You switch this device into your LPT-port and connect to your gentails. Your partener does the same. The device scans your organ and sends the info via WWW. The your partner's device reshapes according to the recieved data and scans organ of your partner. This expensive device allows you to feel your partner online.

[muxec]

P.S: Spec, you are in my buddylist now.

[Lazerus]

I agree with Kroptokin here. Their desperation to get sex make them believe there is a huge stake whenever they date a woman

Imagine how they're going to feel if they eventually get pushed into bed with a woman and become so stressed that their ahem has problems rising to the occasion .. poor guys

ps, muxec that sounds like some serious gadgetry, imagine if they power cut and the device clamped up

[Spiffor]

Azazel :
This is true. However, I don't think it would be a problem for Spec's cousins, as they seem to be more interested by hooking up with anyone, rather than having a long love with a special somebody they already know.

If you don't love anyone during your "hunt", all people you are hunting are "training grounds". It may be bad, but it is so in many cases.

[Az]

You know, some of us are reading these threads to pick up tips too. I was projecting on myself.

[Spiffor]

If you are in love, don't do this indeed. Or try to do this on your crush. It may work

If my experience may help : I have known my girlfriend quite shallowly for 4 months before going out with her. I intended to go out with her shortly before it happened, and it quite surprised her too

My first week of "active lobbying", I just hanged around her very often, which was helped by the many parties that happened this week. However, I didn't spend my whole time with her, and I even spent more time with my friends than with her (she knew it).
At the end of the first week, I've spent the night in her room (not in the same bed), and we've talked during the whole night. At the beginning of the night, I made it perfectly clear that I wanted to go out with her (no brutality in the way of saying it, but it was crystal-clear nonethless), and she refused. We still talked about our lives the whole night, and I didn't even imagine having sex with her at that point. This was however the very moment we have shared most things in our whole relationship.

The following week, I've hanged around her even more, and there were still many parties that allowed it. We even went see a movie, but nothing happened there. Only at the end of the week, she invited me to sleep at ther's after a party, and it was the moment we went out. It wasn't an obvious move for me to go kiss her, but we were more than prepared for it, and she was very receptive.

Our couple is now great

[Az]

Oh, I am in deep ****, my friend. I am afraid I won't be able to do what you said.

I really like what you said about trying it on my crush. "It might work". , well, it also might NOT work. actually, I am certain that I already tried and it didn't.

Haven't seen her for a couple of months now, and sometimes, when I drive through her neighbourhood, I wonder where she is.

Once, I thought I saw her boarding a taxi. I actually followed the taxi, stealthily, for a couple of Kms, but then, I lost it.

I am pathetic.

The funny thing is, that despite me being really sad about it ( and generally speaking, very sad, as described above), I can remove that sadness instantly, by saying it will be alright.

now I am smiling again.

[Flubber]

The cousins have two separate "problems" here

1. they are virgins and don't want to be . . .The solution is easy since sex CAN be bought-- I don't recommend this but it is their choice-- If they don't want a "professional" there probably would be women that would have a fantasy of taking on virgin twins (assuming they are not Butt-ugly or creepy)


2. they are both awkward around women -- the only solution to this is familiarity and confidence . . you can't give it to them but you can talk to them and teach them-- let them know that a lot of women are just as nervous and awkward as them. Also let them know that crashing and burning will happen and the key is to keep trying.

Give them tips on conversation and asking questions-- Any woman should like to talk about herself and her interests . . . The guy can ask short conversational questions that flow from what she is saying. This relieves the pressure of talking a lot while finding out about the woman. If she asks questions in return, answer them BRIEFLY and honestly before returning things to a topic about her. " Me . . ah my work is mainly negotiating sales of petroleum assets . . I enjoy it but sometimes wish I had more time in the outdoors. Do you get to go out in the field much in your geologist job ?" OR " . . . I enjoy it but I've always enjoyed my outside activities more . . . Didn't I hear somewhere that you are a softball player?"


Its a basic basic technique but I doubt the twins know it. You could even practice it with them .Its not hard and if the guy has knows some stuff about his date, he can be ready and KNOW what he is going to say about the obvious job, schooling and interests topics.

Another suggestion is that perhaps you could double-date with one of them -- that way you can carry the coversation when it lags and bring it to topics where the particular guy can shine a little. If you are smooth enough and have a partner/date that you get along with well, there should be little problem in keeping things going.


Last suggestion-- activity dates -- generally non-competitive is best but if you are touring somewhere, or doinf something fun or difficult, the activities themselves keeps the converstaion going, while the activity fills in awkward spaces.

Problem one would get solved in due course if they find a way past problem 2 but I doubt the converse would be true. The question is which problem bugs them more.

I think they need to work on their dating skills just like they would ANY skill. Just ask a girl out, ANY girl that they find even moderately interesting and attractive. They are NOT selecting a life partner here. The assignment is to interest her enough that they get another date. So he learns her interests and plans a date around that. With very little effort you will find out enough to avoid the gaffe of bringing the vegetarian to the steakhouse

If these guys are non-jerks, they should soon enough have a couple of girls each that seem willing to go out with them. Hopefully they get enough confidence that they can then target woment that really really interest them.



Most of this is super basic but if someone is a 28 year old virgin ( that has not chosen virginity as a lifestyle choice either permanently or until marriage) they need to start with the basics. The sex part will work out

[raghar]

You said you found them some girls to talk. Have you explained their problems to that girls. I don't think they would run from two boys just becouse are shy. Two or three weeks with women around their neck and they would learn something. No need for sex, but they would be creazy if you'll manage to get some girls around for 3 weeks and no sex at all.
Could be some problems with girls you choosed.

There are ways how find if they are virgins. You might test them.

[raghar]

To be virgin isn't problem, especialy not for women.
I remmember my sister talks after first child. Something about dirty wather and some restriction.

[August Borms]

give them a song on mp3 instead: "this is the end of all hope! " by nightwish