Turnchat #5 Save and Report

[WhiteBandit]

Here we go! We're still alive at least

101 Gold and 14 Gold Per Turn Right Now
Alphabet in 40 turns... discuss?

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Turnchat #5 Log

Turn 1 2070 BC
Lux slider changed to 10%
Specialist in Asgard working south tile
Iznik building warrior
Change Trondheim's build to a Barracks
Change Iznik's specialist to a scientist

Turn 2 2030 BC
Odin moves NW and waits
Thor moves SE, E
Stack moves into Iznik, all units fortified.
Iznik is now known as "Warrior's Luck"
Settler moves N-W
Asgard changed to Spearman
Lux slider to 0%

Turn 3 1990 BC
Bergen Founded
Move Trondheim's WF on the S tile to the W
Bergen WF works E tile
Thor E, Odin SW
Production in Bergen changed to Barracks
Buy Masonry from Celts for 206 Gold
Bought wheel from Iroquois for 38 Gold and Masonry

Turn 4 1950 BC
Production in Trondheim changed to Spearman
Evidentially we now have contact with a total of SEVEN civs!!!
Odin moves S W
Thor sent to GOTO NE of Warrior's Luck
Otto Slaves moved W (MISTAKE... I read an order ahead of where I was... doh)
WF in Bergen changed from E to SW
WF in Trondheim changed from W to SW
Trondheim production changed to Settler

Turn 5 1910 BC
Odin moves S
Workers Road W, SW of Asgard
Warrior in Warrior's Luck GOTO Bergen
Odin moves W
Native worker moves NW-N-W
Trondheim works newly mined tile and Bergen works tile to east

Turn 6 1870BC
Nothing much besides WF adjustments

Turn 7 1830 BC
Odin skips turn
Worker W of Trond builds road
WF in Trond move to SE- S
Production in Warrior's Luck changed to barracks

Turn 8 1790 BC
Odin moves NW, NW
Slaves W,SW of Asgard mining
Warrior in Bergen Fortify

Turn 8 1750BC
Zulu warrior stack spotted to the NE of Trondheim
Spear in Asgard Fortifies. Warrior there GOTO Trondheim
Warrior in Trond Fortifies
Thor moves S, E
Odin moves NW

Turn 9 1725BC
Zulu Stack of Death moves East into the fog...
Native workers roading to 1 west
Thor GOTO East of Asgard and Odin NW

Turn 10 1700BC
Discover Iron Working, Researching Alphabet
Odin moves NW
Thor moves NE, E
Saving!

[WhiteBandit]

Here is the chat log.

[GodKing]

Some DM issues:

We have a settler ready now. We also have three sites we can send him to. (BTW, sorry Kloreep, some changes were made in your orders due to some errors and discussion in the chat. Hope you don't mind, but I know that with your skill you can fix anything I may have screwed up... )

Site yellow. This was our original plan. This will allow for our early archers.

Iron site. To our west. This is the only known iron for the ottomans also. It will keep it our of their hands and make it available to us. It is however, well away from our capitol and may have some corruption issues.

Horsie site. To our east, on the other side of the mountains. The Zulu recently plopped a city near there, and we will have to fight it with culture (Vikings - Culture?) or weapons to get the horses into our city radii. However, the city site is an excelent one for long term gaming.

Research - what to research next? More of a general quesiton than a DM......

One thing I noticed we were missing in this and the previous chats... FAM assistance. We need some people to join along and keep up with the FAM, as we almost missed a couple of trades that may have been good for us. For example, in turn 9 the english had a worker available, but we choose not to take it because they were asking for 89 g and 2 gpt. Another worker would help us out a lot now, but not at that price. However, how many turns were workers available with some civ that would have only asked 65 gold, that we missed? who knows. We need help folks. GeneralTacticus needs some assistance, so please volunteer if you can.

Spending rate - now we are taking in 100 taxes. We are using the person in Warrior's Luck for science.. However, he is now no longer unhappy, and can be used in production. Should we? Should we adjust the sliders? Something to look at. We kinda skipped over it the last 3 turns of this chat, and I kinda regret doing it. Oh well. To late now.

Some things to think about and discuss.

[GodKing]

Also, Iroc do not have iron (the only civ we know who doesn't). We can trade iron + 15 gold for myst, or iron + 54 gold for horse. I say go for myst, but we must decide now.

There are also a couple more civs we can purchase contact with. Should we?

[Togas]

Looks like the other civs are trading contacts.

Right now we have contact with:

(Civs we've seen)
Ottomans
Zululand
Iriquois
Celts

(Civs we haven't seen that have contact with us)
Persia
Egypt
Germany
Korea
England

(Civs that contact is available for purchase)
Babylon
Japan
Spain

Can we get a few screenshots and a WM?

From looking at the save, it appears that the Iriquois have 2 sources of iron within their cultural borders, they just haven't hooked it up yet.

The Ottoman city Izmit is sitting on horses.


--Togas

[Kloreep]

On Horse Riding vs. Myst: Myst. I assume we're taking the Monarchy road, so we'll need it, and Riding isn't that valuable when we're buliding Archers.

On the slider and Warrior's Luck: My philosophy, especially since we're planning an archer rush, is shields before commerce, always; so I'd like to use the science slider (2 commerce this turn, only 1 for a little after that once Trondheim builds settler) and have Warrior's Luck work a bonus grass. That'll half the build time of the Barracks there. (Good change, BTW; I didn't take the archer garrison into account. )

On the iron site: I think that would be a waste of a settler. If we don't conquer that area, our archer rush will have failed.

On the horse site: Like you say, Vikings are probably one of the worst civs for fighting a culture battle; and the fact that the Zulu got there first would make it even harder. On the other hand, we can't be sure whether we'll be able to afford war with the Zulu, or whether we'll want to; so we may want to settle there eventually, especially if we don't take the war up to Izmit. Regardless, I think the Trondheim settler should found yellow city; it's about time we got another city sharing those juicy bonus grass tiles, and any resources pulled away from the archer rush could turn out to have been vital when our troops start marching.

More DM details later. I'll try to have a new queue up tonight. Edit: Scratch that, it's too late. Tomorrow.

[BigFurryMonster]

Better plant a city on the Cattle and hook up the Iron. Then, send an army of spearmen to the west.

[OPD]

Some trading could be possible.

The following civs have all that we have plus Alphabet, Mysticism and Horseriding. Plus contact with the babs, japs and spanish.

Persia, England, Korea, Celts, Germans, Zulus.

The following have all that we have plus Alphbet, Mysticism and Horse.

Ottomans

The following have Mysticism and Horse but don't have Iron working.

Ironquios

Then there's the hidden civs

Babs, Japan and Spanish


If we get communications with the new civs we could probably get a nice deal for some tech off the otts and ironquios for contact to them plus gold and maybe a tech off the ironquios for IW and a few gold or maybe alpa if we can get it off the otts.
Then perhaps some trading with the hiddens civs could be possible

[civman2000]

Any screenshots?

[GodKing]

OPD, can we trade contacts without having alphabet and/or writing?

[joncnunn]

Looks like the islands were placed too close to each other in some spots.

Originally posted by Togas
Looks like the other civs are trading contacts.

Right now we have contact with:

(Civs we've seen)
Ottomans
Zululand
Iriquois
Celts

(Civs we haven't seen that have contact with us)
Persia
Egypt
Germany
Korea
England

(Civs that contact is available for purchase)
Babylon
Japan
Spain

--Togas

[OPD]

Originally posted by GodKing
OPD, can we trade contacts without having alphabet and/or writing?

I don't know.


But I think it's important to at least try and stay intouch tech wise

[Shiber]

In order to trade contacts, at least one of the two parties must have writing AFAIK.

Good work guys. I'm impressed with the way that this game turned around.

[Octavian X]

I'll confirm that someone needs writing to trade contact.

Any news on possible tech purchases? At this point, we can get some good techs pretty cheap.

[sp0rkius]

whats the point of putting the cities so close together? surely in future when they have huge populations there will be a severe land shortage... and if anyone nukes us we're screwed..

is that a stupid question?

regarding resources i think we should build on the cow for iron because it'll really help us fight the ottos, then maybe we can get up to izmit and the horses.. we may be using archers for now but it pays to be flexible.

why can't we recearch our own technology? surely it's better to put like slider at, say 80% and get it for ourselves than to fund our enemies armies?

i know this is all irrelevant now becasue the orders have gone through but i just thought i'd have my say.

[Kloreep]

Originally posted by sp0rkius
whats the point of putting the cities so close together? surely in future when they have huge populations there will be a severe land shortage... and if anyone nukes us we're screwed..

Hospitals, and especially nukes, are far in the future. We get almost no corruption with this tight build, which will allow us to churn out units (Archers and spears in 3 or 4 turns at optimal production, swords and horsies in 5 or 6 turns) and since it will likely be a while before we can even pause our warmongering to build aqueducts, this is the best use we can make of our capitol position & the decent surrounding combination of bonus grasses and forest. It's certainly not a long term position, but these cities will be great for military building right now, and some (like Copenhagen) will probably be permanent.

is that a stupid question?

Nope, not at all. DGs are all about sharing strategies, debating actions, etc.

regarding resources i think we should build on the cow for iron because it'll really help us fight the ottos, then maybe we can get up to izmit and the horses.. we may be using archers for now but it pays to be flexible.

I agree, we need Iron. If we save enough money, we can build Warriors until it's connected, then mass-upgrade them to swordsman.

why can't we recearch our own technology? surely it's better to put like slider at, say 80% and get it for ourselves than to fund our enemies armies?

I guess you're referring to the Wheel and Iron Working purchases. I wasn't at this chat, so I can't give the reasons for the exact deals, but some factors in the general strategy of buying: So far as I know, it is cheaper, raw commerce wise, to buy tech than to research it yourself (though having more libraries than markets would skew things toward research). Also, so long as you put at least 1 beaker (paying 1 commerce or having 1 scientist specialist in a city) into researching a tech each turn, you are guaranteed to have it in 40 turns, no matter what the time should be; thus, if a tech should cost, say, 80 beakers, you can get it for only 40 if you spend 40 turns researching it at 1 beaker a turn; this is a very cheap way of researching things, and the only downside is that you have to buy the techs you don't research this way. Finally, Masonry is needed for Walls (useful if someone attacks us, especially since they're half-price for our Militaristic civ) and The Wheel is needed for seeing Horses on the map (and building chariots, which upgrade to Horsies), so they are quite useful techs, especially for warmongers.

[Panag]

Originally posted by Kloreep


Hospitals, and especially nukes, are far in the future. We get almost no corruption with this tight build, which will allow us to churn out units (Archers and spears in 3 or 4 turns at optimal production, swords and horsies in 5 or 6 turns) and since it will likely be a while before we can even pause our warmongering to build aqueducts, this is the best use we can make of our capitol position & the decent surrounding combination of bonus grasses and forest. It's certainly not a long term position, but these cities will be great for military building right now, and some (like Copenhagen) will probably be permanent.



Nope, not at all. DGs are all about sharing strategies, debating actions, etc.



I agree, we need Iron. If we save enough money, we can build Warriors until it's connected, then mass-upgrade them to swordsman.



I guess you're referring to the Wheel and Iron Working purchases. I wasn't at this chat, so I can't give the reasons for the exact deals, but some factors in the general strategy of buying: So far as I know, it is cheaper, raw commerce wise, to buy tech than to research it yourself (though having more libraries than markets would skew things toward research). Also, so long as you put at least 1 beaker (paying 1 commerce or having 1 scientist specialist in a city) into researching a tech each turn, you are guaranteed to have it in 40 turns, no matter what the time should be; thus, if a tech should cost, say, 80 beakers, you can get it for only 40 if you spend 40 turns researching it at 1 beaker a turn; this is a very cheap way of researching things, and the only downside is that you have to buy the techs you don't research this way. Finally, Masonry is needed for Walls (useful if someone attacks us, especially since they're half-price for our Militaristic civ) and The Wheel is needed for seeing Horses on the map (and building chariots, which upgrade to Horsies), so they are quite useful techs, especially for warmongers.

hi ,

, if you can plan your future more or the less you have won half of the game , ......

planning ahead with a decent structural plan is worth it , .....

have a nice day

[sp0rkius]

planning ahead with a decent structural plan is worth it

but you can plan ahead and still have the optimum strategy for now, e.g. have lots of cities now and consolidate them into a few when you have hospitals by sending settlers from the smaller cities to the bigger ones and abandoning the smaller cities when they've 1 population.

[Panag]

Originally posted by sp0rkius


but you can plan ahead and still have the optimum strategy for now, e.g. have lots of cities now and consolidate them into a few when you have hospitals by sending settlers from the smaller cities to the bigger ones and abandoning the smaller cities when they've 1 population.

hi ,

true , but in this game we dont have settlers in abundance , therefore we should use them wisely , a case that is not been done now , .....

have a nice day

[WhiteBandit]

Originally posted by panag


hi ,

true , but in this game we dont have settlers in abundance , therefore we should use them wisely , a case that is not been done now , .....

have a nice day

As far as I know we have been using the settlers wisely. We aren't just throwing them anywhere because we can. We have some brilliant minds in our ministries and I'm fairly sure they've weighed the options of what city sites would be the most effective to settle.