Israelis withdraw from Gaza

Solver · June 30, 2003, 07:52

Quote:

JERUSALEM (CNN) -- Israel on Monday handed over control of the major north-south highway running through Gaza to the Palestinians, removing a number of checkpoints, an Israel Defense Forces spokeswoman said.

Israeli troops withdrew from northern Gaza on Sunday after Palestinian militant groups declared a cease-fire.

The Israeli departure from northern Gaza is the first step toward handing security chores in that region over to the Palestinians, as part of the Mideast "road map" to peace.

With the return to Palestinian control of the main north-south road in Gaza, Palestinian traffic will no longer be subject to Israeli controls along the route.

Palestinian traffic will be routed around the Jewish settlement of Kfar Darom.

After Israeli troops had begun their withdrawal, Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat's Fatah movement said Sunday evening it would stop all military actions against Israel, joining a cease-fire announced earlier by the militant groups Islamic Jihad and Hamas.

The Fatah announcement would apply to the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, the militant group aligned with it. Though Fatah did not announce a time frame, it referenced an Egyptian cease-fire initiative, which included a six-month truce.

Earlier, Hamas and Islamic Jihad released a statement agreeing to stop their attacks for three months.

Islamic Jihad, Hamas and the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades are on the U.S. State Department's list of terrorist organizations and have admitted attacks on Israelis.

The actions coincided with a visit to the region by U.S. national security adviser Condoleezza Rice, the third top U.S. official to visit the Mideast in the last month. President Bush and Secretary of State Colin Powell preceded her.

Israel: Crackdown on groups still needed
Israeli officials said a cease-fire signed by groups they consider terrorists would mean little unless the Palestinian Authority begins to crack down on the militant groups.

"It's not enough to have an internal truce between these groups and the Palestinian Authority," said Ra'anan Gissin, a senior adviser to Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon. "They have to dismantle the terrorist groups and stop the incitement."

A small group of Palestinian militants, Gissin said, is keeping the rest of the Palestinian population from achieving peace.

Israeli Finance Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told CNN that Israeli intelligence had reports that Palestinian militants were planning more attacks against Israelis.

"Now we can't say right now if there's any letup in this, because we don't see it yet," the former prime minister said on Late Edition with Wolf Blitzer. "But we hope there will be, obviously a reduction, indeed an end to these things.

"The only way you can achieve that is by having the Palestinians do what President Bush has demanded them to do, that is to take apart the terrorist organizations which launch the terrorists."

Israeli soldiers remove concrete barricades before withdrawing Sunday from the Gaza town of Beit Hanoun.
Palestinian Cabinet member Ghassan Khatib told CNN he "can understand why Israeli officials are nervous ... because, if this is going to be successful, then the Israelis will be faced from their side with having to fulfill their obligations from the road map."

In Washington, White House spokeswoman Ashley Snee said there was "still more work to be done."

"Anything that reduces violence is a step in the right direction," she said. "Under the road map, parties have an obligation to dismantle terrorist infrastructures."

Although the cease-fire was to take effect immediately, the Islamic Jihad and Hamas statement contained several demands of Israel:

• An end to Israeli attacks against Palestinians, including assassination of Hamas and Islamic Jihad leaders and the destruction of the homes of suspected militants, an end to incursions into Palestinian territory and a removal of Israeli checkpoints in Gaza.

• Protection of Islamic holy places.

• An end to the siege that has kept Arafat confined to his Ramallah, West Bank, compound for months.

• Release of all Palestinian prisoners from Israeli jails.

Ismail Abu Shanab, Hamas political spokesman in Gaza, told CNN in a telephone interview that the cease-fire would not be endangered if all Palestinian prisoners were not released. He said the groups wanted the initial release of the 932 Palestinians held in administrative detention without charges and a viable process begun to eventually obtain the release of the other prisoners.

The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine said Saturday it would not be a part of the truce, Palestinian sources told CNN. But on Sunday, Palestinian Cabinet member Saeb Erakat told CNN the group had pledged it would "not break the national consensus."

In Jerusalem, Rice completed meetings with Sharon and a joint meeting between Israeli and Palestinian officials early Sunday, followed by a meeting with the Israeli Cabinet.

She met Saturday with Palestinian officials, including Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas.

-- CNN Senior International Correspondent Sheila MacVicar, Correspondents Matthew Chance and Jerrold Kessel, Producer Rida Said, and White House Correspondent Dana Bash contributed to this report.

I first heard that the government rejected the terrorist-proposed ceasfire. And the world is just plain great. Terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan are seeked and dealt with, while all the world keeps telling Israel to negotiate with the terrorists on their soil. A ceasfire with a terrorist organization... I have doubt that it will last.

Eli · June 30, 2003, 07:57

One Israeli was killed in a shooting terract in Northern Samaria a few hours ago.

I'm waiting for Chegitz to post a thread about how the Palestinians are ruining the cease fire...

muxec · June 30, 2003, 08:25

Now Hamas have 3 monthes for rearming and reqruiting before the new wave of terror. The peace plan sucks.

Al'Kimiya · June 30, 2003, 08:47

Quote:

Hudna: Big Victory for Hamas
12:47 Jun. 30, '03 / 30 Sivan 5763

Foreign Minister Shalom said today that the hudna is a "ticking timebomb." Arab affairs expert Dr. Guy Bechor writes that Israel is now a hostage of Hamas.

Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom told the Knesset Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee today that the hudna is a "ticking timebomb." He said that Israel is not a partner to this agreement, and "if the PA does not dismantle the terrorist organizations, there will be no progress in the peace process."

Arab affairs expert Dr. Guy Bechor of the Interdisciplinary Center in Herzliya writes in Yediot Acharonot today that Hamas and Islamic Jihad are the big winners in this process:
"Israel will not even be able to take simple preventative actions on behalf of its citizens without being portrayed as having violated the agreement. This may be good in the short run, but it's a bad scenario for the long run for the Road Map and the possible peace process. Does anyone even remember that the Road Map stipulates that the PA is supposed to dismantle the Islamic terrorist organizations?"

Bechor further wrote that just like Hizbullah in Lebanon after Operation Grapes of Wrath, it will be Hamas now that will be the judge whether Israel is fulfilling or violating the agreement, and Hamas will decide when and how the hudna is to end. "Israel and the PA have become hostages of Hamas," Bechor writes. "These three months in which Israel's hands will be tied will enable [Hamas] to rebuild its military infrastructures and its underground cells that were greatly damaged, and to disseminate weapons."

Solver · June 30, 2003, 08:49

to Silvan Shalom.

laurentius · June 30, 2003, 08:55

Give peace a chance?

Sirotnikov · June 30, 2003, 09:02

How is "we will stop attacking you for 3 months to regroup and continue later" even remotely similar to the idea of "peace".

Hudna , as it is called in arabic, is not a peacefull ceasfire but rather a tactical cease fire whose declared goal is the continuation of hostilities later, with better forces.

It's a religious term for a temporary truce for regrouping, in a Jihad war against non-muslims.

Don't be fooled.

In other more important news: Several border patrol and other IDF brigades have been dismantled and the serving soldiers and commanding officers are either investigated or already facing trial in cases of abuse against Palestinian civilians, and extreme use of lethal force against innocent civilians.

Way to go.

muxec · June 30, 2003, 09:06

Quote:

Hudna , as it is called in arabic

Huinya, as it is called in Russian.

Solver · June 30, 2003, 09:12

You know muxec, intentional cursing isn't acceptable even if it's another language... and it's one of the worst words

.

Sirotnikov · June 30, 2003, 09:16

@ muxec for cursing
@ solver for trying to get muxec banned

Solver · June 30, 2003, 09:25

Meh, I'm not trying to get him banned. He was released just yesterday... and although I may feel the wish to give him a ban... not yet

.

muxec · July 1, 2003, 01:34

I thing it was right. Do you have another word for caesfire for rearming before the next wave of war?

Politologists and historians claim, that within 30 years there would not be two two nations in the region. Arabs or Jews will be completely vanished from the region.

P.S: No it's Ming priority to ban me. Just look at my location (near the flag).
Solver would better ban MRT144

blackice · July 1, 2003, 03:48

So far so good

Eli · July 1, 2003, 04:05

Quote:

Originally posted by blackice
So far so good

Of course. A dead Israeli doesnt count. It's only Israeli actions that can damage the cease fire.

Dis · July 1, 2003, 04:07

you know, I always say this. Give peace a chance. I always say this time will be the time. And I alway say, if it doesn't work this time, I'll give up hoping for peace.

I've been saying that for a while now

. I guess I'm the type of person never to give up hope.

lord of the mark · July 1, 2003, 09:48

its a temporary truce, and doesnt call for dismarming Hamas. OTOH, it may give time for Israeli diplomacy with Abbas to move forward, and to strengthen Abbas. Then when Hamas comes out fighting Abbas can fight them - if he doesnt, the road map has real problems.

Haaretz quotes Israeli officials saying Abbas told the Americans he would press Hamas to disarm, but cant say so in public.

Also - the shooting the other day was by Al aqsa Martyrs Brigade - there seems to be a strugle for power within AAMB, Marwan Bargouti (who supported the ceasefire) against local elements. Note also the shooting did not come from areas slated for Israeli withdrawl.

lord of the mark · July 1, 2003, 09:51

from the BBC

"Militants shot at a lorry in the West Bank on Monday, killing one man
The militants who shot dead a Bulgarian worker in the West Bank yesterday have been arrested, Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat has said. "

muxec · July 1, 2003, 12:03

LOTMark, read Haaretz less! It's very optimistical. You would better read MigNews.

Panag · July 1, 2003, 14:57

1. Cease-fire in full force (except in Hebron)
At 9:45 tonight Arab terrorists opened fire on the Givat Avot neighborhood of Kiryat Arba. Shots were fired at a soldier guarding at the entrance to the neighborhood, which is to the west of Kiryat Arba, and overlooks the Hebron Jewish Community from the north-east. The soldier's helmet was scratched but no other injuries were reported. IDF troops are searching the vicinity for the terrorist or terrorists.

A Hebron spokesman issued the following statement:
Israel is again experiencing euphoria - peace is at hand! What nonsense!!! Unfortunately nothing could be further from the truth. Tonight's attack on a Kiryat Arba neighborhood proves the point. The Arab have no intentions of ceasing warfare. They have one goal and one goal alone - the removal of all Jews from Israel and the establishment of a unified 'palestine' from the Jordan to the Mediterranean. Unfortunately Israel is playing into their hands by tonight removing forces from Gaza, thereby endangering the lives of hundreds and thousands of Jews, who have been the targets of countless mortar, missile and shooting attacks over the past two and a half years. According to Israel radio, tomorrow negotiations to again abandon Bethlehem will commence and following that, Israel is considering handing Hebron back to the terrorists. The absurdity is so colossal that it is difficult to believe that any sane national leadership could actually cooperate. However, that is exactly what Arik Sharon and Co. are doing. There are no words.....

hi ,

the above is from the 29th , ......

have a nice day

JCG · July 1, 2003, 15:06

Will the truce (and the whole peace plan) be abandoned by Israel just because a few of the Arab terrorist groups that didn't sign/agree to it decide to continue terror?

Provided that the PA cooperates as much as it can while all this is happening, of course....

Panag · July 1, 2003, 15:07

Quote:

Originally posted by JCG
Will the truce (and the whole peace plan) be abandoned by Israel just because a few of the Arab terrorist groups that didn't sign/agree to it decide to continue terror?

Provided that the PA cooperates as much as it can while all this is happening, of course....

hi ,

have we ever " abondoned " any peace plan , .....

it aint us who are shooting just hours after we sign a deal , ......

have a nice day

Az · July 1, 2003, 15:09

Quote:

Originally posted by JCG
Will the truce (and the whole peace plan) be abandoned by Israel just because a few of the Arab terrorist groups that didn't sign/agree to it decide to continue terror?

Ok, so let me get this straight. We don't even have the right to act against the elements that openly fight us, while a truce could be in place? please.

JCG · July 1, 2003, 15:10

Quote:

Originally posted by panag

hi ,

have we ever " abondoned " any peace plan , .....

it aint us who are shooting just hours after we sign a deal , ......

have a nice day

My point is: the people who are shooting aren't necessarily the same ones who signed the deal (at least in this case).

JCG · July 1, 2003, 15:14

Quote:

Originally posted by Azazel

Ok, so let me get this straight. We don't even have the right to act against the elements that openly fight us, while a truce could be in place? please.

Perhaps you may have the right, but if those actions are executed in such a way that they create conflict with the PA and the other groups that signed the truce and are keeping to it (not to mention the civilian population)...then it could all go to hell pretty quickly.

Panag · July 1, 2003, 15:15

Quote:

Originally posted by JCG

My point is: the people who are shooting aren't necessarily the same ones who signed the deal (at least in this case).

hi ,

huh , in this case they had signed the deal , .......

have a nice day

Az · July 1, 2003, 15:20

Quote:

Originally posted by JCG

Perhaps you may have the right, but if those actions are executed in such a way that they create conflict with the PA and the other groups that signed the truce and are keeping to it (not to mention the civilian population)...then it could all go to hell pretty quickly.

So then we should sit and take it like men?

JCG · July 1, 2003, 15:21

Quote:

Originally posted by panag

hi ,

huh , in this case they had signed the deal , .......

have a nice day

Then...in that case, things will indeed go to hell much quicker, due to the internal struggles within those groups, if action is taken without discussing with the elements that *did* keep to the deal.

JCG · July 1, 2003, 15:23

Quote:

Originally posted by Azazel

So then we should sit and take it like men?

No, you should take action alright, BUT trying to do so only in cooperation and agreement with those Arabs that *do* respect the truce.

That may be the hard part, I'm afraid.

lord of the mark · July 1, 2003, 15:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Azazel

Ok, so let me get this straight. We don't even have the right to act against the elements that openly fight us, while a truce could be in place? please.

i think the understanding is you will give the PA the first shot at the elements, and if they cant or wont take it, you will check with Washington before executing.

Az · July 1, 2003, 15:36

Quote:

Originally posted by JCG

No, you should take action alright, BUT trying to do so only in cooperation and agreement with those Arabs that *do* respect the truce.

That may be the hard part, I'm afraid.

They don't want to. we wouldn't act against the palestinians at all if they got their **** together, and stopped the attacks against us.

lotm: Abu Mazen has specifically said that he won't fight Hamas. instead, there is some half-assed truce with terrorist organizations that maybe would, and maybe wouldn't be honoured.