Why are you putting GalCiv aside? - Page 3

MichaeltheGreat · September 19, 2003, 19:02

I play large and huge galaxies, where for the most part exploration and later interaction are more important.

There's actually a lot of tweaking and changes in the game that result from the galaxy size, star clustering and habitable planet frequency, and from the choice of minor abilities you get to customize the human player.

The changes in AI behavior in the expansion are interesting in a lot of ways. One of my two games I have currently, large universe, lots of habitable planets, punishing difficulty, I found myself in the center of the galaxy, with three minor race neighbors in adjacent sectors.

Not that many planets overall, compared to everyone else, but a good enough start, and the combination of distance and minor races that annoyed the other AI and left me alone allowed me to grow like crazy. I kept the minor races happy by selling them techs so they could get ornery with their neighbors, and I used the money to buy wonders and rush constructors to get all the distant resources in the empty spots of the galaxy. My military power consisted of two found corvettes and three up-junked survey ships while everyone else had battleship tech and frigates out the wazoo.

I had the productive ability, but never built the ships. When the Arceans decided to teach me a lesson, I had Eyes of the Universe, Tri-Strontium, and Gravity Accelerators (got them all very early) and all the speed techs. Between harvesting anomolies and the military resources, my whopping new fleet of half a dozen battle cruisers are dreadnaught strength, with more speed, and nothing close to the production or maintenance costs. Meanwhile, my research keeps going, and everybody but the Arceans loves me and my trade.

Another game under the same conditions is virtually the opposite - but I started with the Drengin close by, and caught them with their pants down and overwhelmed their planets before they got more than the occasional defender.

The feel of the game is totally different from the tiny or small galaxy, scare or average habitable planet frequency setup.

vee4473 · September 20, 2003, 22:07

Quote:

Originally posted by Asmodean

On the contrary. It delivers everything it offers. I think the problem is that many find it too hard. People want to take on GalCiv the same way they take on most strategy games, but they find that that is just not possible. They need to rethink, and then it is easier to revert back to SMAC, MOO or whatever.

Asmodean

Excellent point. Many seem not to like Galciv because of the need to learn new strategies based on the game's rules.

It took me the longest time to realize the importance of starbases before I stopped getting my ass beat.

Galciv has some micro problems (but I am sure they are handled well with the governers once I truly learn how to use them), but overall it is fun.

Harry Seldon · September 22, 2003, 13:39

Quote:

It took me the longest time to realize the importance of starbases before I stopped getting my ass beat.

I learned quickly. I usually only have to lose one starbase to toast my chances at galactic supremecy. It's amazing what a difference a SB can make.

peterfharris · October 19, 2003, 19:21

Umh, I put the game aside thinking I might not play it anymore. For some reason I suddenly felt like giving it another try and enjoyed the game, then I enjoyed a second game of GalCiv. I think I will be playing this game, on and off, for quite a while.

Chronus · October 21, 2003, 00:08

I played like gang-busters the first few months, took a couple of months off, and then went back to playing it the last couple of months. Like many fun things, you just need to take a break now and then.

The more I play it, the better it gets.

Dr Strangelove · October 26, 2003, 10:37

I have tried the demo, and I'm now convinced that I will not buy this game. It is hideously unbalanced. You start out with an ability to explore the whole map and make contact with other civs, but you have no ability to trade or fight for a long time. Compared to the speed with which you explore research and construction proceeds at a snail's pace. There are other features which aren't well thought out. When a ship explores new solar syems you can see a picture of the planet, but get no readout of the atmosphere or minerals so you have to guess whether its worth settling. I could go on, but what's the point? It's not worht wasting time on. This game isn't even up to the standards I'd have expected 15 years ago.

vee4473 · October 26, 2003, 21:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
I have tried the demo, and I'm now convinced that I will not buy this game. It is hideously unbalanced. You start out with an ability to explore the whole map and make contact with other civs, but you have no ability to trade or fight for a long time. Compared to the speed with which you explore research and construction proceeds at a snail's pace. There are other features which aren't well thought out. When a ship explores new solar syems you can see a picture of the planet, but get no readout of the atmosphere or minerals so you have to guess whether its worth settling. I could go on, but what's the point? It's not worht wasting time on. This game isn't even up to the standards I'd have expected 15 years ago.

Well, you can only explore the whole map on small maps. On the large maps, you need to research range enhancing techs.

Admittedly, the planet class system is simple, but hardly a game of guessing.

Anything 15 or higher is worth settling. Later in the game, when you research more of the habitat improving techs, then you can settle lower class planets.

kinda harsh criticism that really is kinda baseless. I mean, the 2 things that you point out aren't even correct.

peterfharris · October 27, 2003, 18:41

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
I have tried the demo, and I'm now convinced that I will not buy this game. It is hideously unbalanced. You start out with an ability to explore the whole map and make contact with other civs, but you have no ability to trade or fight for a long time. Compared to the speed with which you explore research and construction proceeds at a snail's pace. There are other features which aren't well thought out. When a ship explores new solar syems you can see a picture of the planet, but get no readout of the atmosphere or minerals so you have to guess whether its worth settling. I could go on, but what's the point? It's not worht wasting time on. This game isn't even up to the standards I'd have expected 15 years ago.

I find that trade comes fairly early, at about the time I am ready to build a trade freighter (and after I have built my first colony ships and a few starfighters for defence).

You can start fighting very very early. Just research a few techs to get starfighters and troop transports.

Only the smallest maps can be completely explored without first building more colonies or starbases to extend range. Gigantic maps take ages to explore.

With planets, the bigger the better, no guessing needed.

If you are finding research takes forever you probably need to review how you use your budget sliders. If you start off with say 70% of your income devoted to military and 30% to science you can science at a decent rate and churn out those colony ships. Also consider deficit spending at the start of the game.

Hope this helps.

Dr Strangelove · October 27, 2003, 20:06

The demo is restricted to a small map. It may be that they shouldn't have put all 6 races on one small map, as it pushes too far forward the time when you begin to encounter other races, and it gives each one too little room to expand. In the past four tries another race has beat me to the nearest habitable solar system, in fact I haven't been able to settle outside my own system because the adjacent systems get grabbed before I get to them.

Demos should be designed to sell the product, not bore the potential customer away.

vee4473 · October 28, 2003, 20:09

Quote:

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
The demo is restricted to a small map. It may be that they shouldn't have put all 6 races on one small map, as it pushes too far forward the time when you begin to encounter other races, and it gives each one too little room to expand. In the past four tries another race has beat me to the nearest habitable solar system, in fact I haven't been able to settle outside my own system because the adjacent systems get grabbed before I get to them.

Demos should be designed to sell the product, not bore the potential customer away.

I have not played the demo, so I can't comment on it, but i apologize for snapping at ya.

Anyway, the initial blitz to colonize is indeed a valid criticism. It does get old fast. Some have compared it to the "settler diarrhea" in civ 3.

But, it sounds like the demo could have done a better job of selling the game.

Dr Strangelove · October 30, 2003, 18:53

I tried the demo after deleting two of the major races and it played much better. Maybe I'll buy the full game after all.

uglyduck · October 31, 2003, 00:26

Good man!

Yep - it took me a while before I found that the Major Races could be simply turned off! ...

Does anyone know if this is counted as "cheating" and prevents the finished game being given a score when uploading to Metaverse?

Kloreep · October 31, 2003, 01:29

Quote:

Originally posted by uglyduck
Does anyone know if this is counted as "cheating" and prevents the finished game being given a score when uploading to Metaverse?

No, it's not cheating. However, the number of civs and each's intelligence level affects what your difficulty rating is, and deleting races and/or lowering their intelligence means a lower difficulty rating. And while I don't know the exact score formula, low difficulty rating=low score.

Draginol · November 20, 2003, 15:18

How do people feel about GalCiv 1.12?

Main_Brain · November 24, 2003, 09:07

Dunno. The Patches dont do exactly do good to my German Version. I get a two-language hybrid that crashes when someone enters the New Event-in-Space's.
No German PAtches availible. bah!

Sikander · November 24, 2003, 23:47

I picked this game up because I was bored and hoped that I would find a new game to grab me. I put it down almost immediately because in large part the user interface was so weak. It sounds like the new expansion pack is going to address that somewhat, which is good. I second the request for a zoomable main map (if it is missing from the expansion). The game graphics are nothing special, so it seems as though having a zooming main map wouldn't be all that hard to implement. It would however be a huge help to me, especially on larger maps.

Also an in game tech tree and hyper links all over the place would really help the game. SMAC sets the standard here in every way, including the zooming.

Anyway, I've played a few hours more of the game and I'm not sure what is going on. It isn't very interesting honestly, but perhaps I'm just completely clueless about the intense struggle going on behing the scenes. Very little has happened, other than even at average level the AI has heavily out colonized me. I don't want to go balls to the walls on a colony ship binge in order to not lose the game honestly. It would help if somewhere the game was described in some detail. The manual acts as a good guide for someone who is interested in purchasing the game, but is of little use to someone who actually has it and wants to play. Slogging through hundreds of posts by more advanced players is extremely time consuming as well. The game needs (prior to the patch anyway) a good deal more internal documentation or a much better manual.

I'm not sure whether to play again tonight, or go back to EU2.

peterfharris · November 27, 2003, 18:25

Sikander. I had no idea what I was doing in my first game (at the lowest difficulty level). It does take a while to get the hang of this game. I think it is one of those games that does take while to really get the hang of. This game is well worth a little perseverance to get over the "learning curve".

I had a bit of trouble learning the game then had GalCiv jag for a few months, then I put the game aside for a couple of months and still play it from time to time. Overall it is certainly one of the better games and I felt I obtained excellent entertainment value for my dollars.

Hang in there for couple of games, perhaps you will change your mind about GalCiv.

LDiCesare · November 29, 2003, 04:01

The most important change in 1.12 is the minors extending out. I think the hyperlinks have been improved a bit since I can actually see the effects of techs now, but I'm not sure since how it is there.

SolarKnight · February 6, 2004, 08:17

The main thing that puts me off sometimes is that i get into the game, (im playing easiest setting s i can get used to it) and then for no reason whatsoever, the game locks up completely and never recovers.

It just seems to be completely stable for the most part, then suddenly have a heart attack and die.

By the way, im using the latest version with the expanded universe update.

My system can more than handle it, its an AMD 2700+
with 512 MB of ram
Sapphire Radeon 9600 Atlantis graphics

I just get to a certain stage in the game, (its usually different every time) and the game just gives up.

vee4473 · February 6, 2004, 19:44

Solar, Try going to the galciv website and emailing them. From what i've heard, they seem to be prompt with helping out.

SolarKnight · February 9, 2004, 15:28

Thanks, ill try that

eberon · March 10, 2004, 11:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Draginol

What expansion pack have you played lately?[...]I can't think of any free patches in any game I've played that have added as much as we've added post-release let alone what's in the expansion pack beta already.

This is a widely belated reply, but..... Give me a BREAK. Don't make me post the Alpha Centauri 4.0 through 2.0 readme file to this forum. If you want to talk about giving users value, maybe you should take a page from Sid's book.

Yef · March 26, 2004, 15:26

I stopped because somehow I found Space Empire 4 to be more engaging. I mean, Galciv have many plus, and its definitively superior as far as diplomacy goes, but SE4 have many more options in other aspects.
If I could just mix them into one......

ducki · April 8, 2004, 13:38

Quote:

Also an in game tech tree and hyper links all over the place would really help the game.

I downloaded the demo and tried it last night and I have to say this is my single biggest "gripe". For comparison(which I know devs don't always enjoy), Civ3's Civilopedia is a very nice example - from just about anywhere in the game, I can right-click on something and get the 'pedia page for it. The tech tree is wonderful, IMO. Not necessarily the tree's contents, but the tree's implementation and design - I have a visual diagram that shows me where I am and where I can go and I can right-click any tech to get the 'pedia entry on it with links to 'pedia entries for all the stuff it enables.

Put most simply, Civ 3 makes it such that a new player need not ever read (or even know about) a manual, strategy guides, websites, etc. Sure, those things might help you, but you truly, honestly don't need anything that's not available in-game in order to play and (feel like) you know what you're doing. Alpha Centauri was the same way - manual? What manual?

Unfortunately, this puts the bar rather high for the indies and smaller developers that want to attract part of the Sid-game players.

I somewhat enjoyed the demo, as it is novel, an interesting amalgamation of various games dating back to my childhood, but I felt truly lost. (Note: part of this may be that the "tutorial" mode doesn't recover if you "accidentally" click outside its current context to "explore" the interface - either lock stuff outside the current tutorial context or confirm the player wants to leave it or make it easy to return to where you were.)

Anyway, I think I might like GalCiv, but the demo doesn't really sell me on it. Apart from being novel, it doesn't really show me what GalCiv and Stardock have that C3 or SMAC or that really old Star Trek(or StarTrek-like) ASCII space exploration/battle game don't have. (Anyone remember what that game was? GC reminds me a lot of it, but I can't truly recall.)

So, to sum up, GC seems like a nice game. I might like it, but I'm going to have to invest more time than simply playing the demo to find out. My foray into this forum was primarily to check the 'poly barometer on what the game is like, which hasn't truly helped other than to show that Stardock are, indeed, responsive.

bonscott · April 13, 2004, 15:16

FYI...there is an in game tech tree in GalCiv. It's not a full tree like in Civ 3 but you can see a tech, what are is prereq's and what techs become available after researching it. You can then click your way forward or back as you see fit to get info on other techs.

From the diplomacy screen you can right-click on any technology or trade good listed to get more information about it. There needs to be more, no doubt, but the basics are in there. The demo version may not have the tech tree but the most updated version does (has had it for about 6 months or so).

PLATO · April 15, 2004, 00:30

Quote:

Originally posted by bonscott
FYI...there is an in game tech tree in GalCiv. It's not a full tree like in Civ 3 but you can see a tech, what are is prereq's and what techs become available after researching it. You can then click your way forward or back as you see fit to get info on other techs.

From the diplomacy screen you can right-click on any technology or trade good listed to get more information about it. There needs to be more, no doubt, but the basics are in there. The demo version may not have the tech tree but the most updated version does (has had it for about 6 months or so).

Wasn't that an "Expanded Universe" upgrade?

bonscott · April 19, 2004, 11:06

Yep. It was version 1.2 I believe released in Sept last year. I think the Demo is based off of version 1.03 or something early like that. Thus why it doesn't have the tech tree viewer.

ducki · May 2, 2004, 13:01

Thanks for the info, guys.
I'll give it another try next time there's a demo update.

bonscott · May 10, 2004, 15:25

Don't expect an update of the Demo. I don't think they will do one. They are just about done with GalCiv other then minor bug updates after the expansion is released. Then it's on to two new games, including GalCiv 2.

Gwylim · May 19, 2004, 19:51

i liked very much to play some games of GalCiv and was not angry that i have baught it, but in the end i played much, much more CIV than i can ever imagining to play GalCiv !!!!
For me the main critic is the failing real map and the tile improvement. It is just to abstract for me to see this black space all the time.
What i love is the user interface - i think it is well suited and i had no prblm to learn the rules/playing of GalCiv: For me it was enough to play one game for testing.
But again: It is too boring too soon