Mozilla 1.4 : Finally worth the move

Sirotnikov · July 21, 2003, 20:58

I dislike Microsoft and I dislike IE but there is nothing really better.

Opera is nice, cool, swift and quick, and yet it's.... somehow 'ubrowser-like'. You toy with it and it's quick and sleek, but it seems more like some project one would build utilzing the IE engine, rather a stand-alone browser.

I've been downloading and testing Mozilla ever since the 0.7 version and always hoped "this would be the one" to make me move.

From version 0.9 I already moved my e-mail account to the new mail manager, from my old 4.7, and I still haven't got a single worm or virus from e-mail. (not having silly friends with your e-mail in their address book also helps, though I did recieve some rare letters with VBS files, that DID NOT open automatically, whcih I simply deleted.)

Somehow, when I downloaded 1.4 today, and read about people saying it's worth the move, I felt like smircking. "Yeah that's what I always like to think, and then I go back to IE".

But somehow, this release feels like a stable, quick and finished browser.

It doesn't hog my memory. It is fast and error free on my pages. It doesn't try to circumvent my fire-wall and ad-blocker and insists on loading active-x (flash) ads behind my back. It doesn't alert me a THOUSAND times, that the active-x component I told it not to run, will probably ruin my whole browsing experience, like IE used to do.

It just works. With hebrew and with russian.

It loads many complex pages much quicker than IE.

Since it isn't so sorrowly integrated into my Windows, it makes no attempts to, for what ever reasons, read my harddisks at random places at random intervals, while failing to process a draw window command.

Finally, I feel at home with Mozilla 1.4.

Why don't you to?

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:00

Because it takes way longer to load, doesn't support the Google Toolbar's (better) way of blocking popups, is still substantially buggier than IE, and its future is in doubt with last week's laying off of 50 of their software engineers.

Not to mention that the interface is noticably less responsive than IE.

DanS · July 21, 2003, 21:00

I agree. I've used Mozilla for a while, but the latest releases are really quite good.

St Leo · July 21, 2003, 21:12

Now that Asher's got his two pennies in, it's my turn.

MSIE is the Jugo. Mozilla is the Jeep. Opera is the Mini.

Go, Opera, go.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:13

Quote:

Because it takes way longer to load, doesn't support the Google Toolbar's (better) way of blocking popups, is still substantially buggier than IE, and its future is in doubt with last week's laying off of 50 of their software engineers.

True about google, although I have no complaints about the pop-up protection. How is it buggier? (in terms of major bugs, the minor stuff that gets reported to Mozilla but MS can afford to ignore). Netscapes closing down wont hurt Mozilla, because many developers have moved to Mozilla, and Aol will support Mozilla too. Financially, it looks good.

It does take longer to load, granted, however the new versions are being de-bloated, and on my machine its not exactly noticeable anyway!

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:14

St Leo:

Imran Siddiqui · July 21, 2003, 21:14

Quote:

MSIE is the Jugo. Mozilla is the Jeep. Opera is the Mini.

Mini's suck

.

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:14

Opera is one of those PowerWheels toys, Mozilla is a semi, and IE is a Lexus.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:15

Imran:

Imran Siddiqui · July 21, 2003, 21:16

Really, how am I supposed to fit, along with other people and stuff like bookbags, in one of those crapmobiles?

IE is definetly a Lexus

.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:17

IE is a 1956 Porche Spyder, Mozilla is an E-type Jag

and Opera is a Triumph TR-6!!

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:17

Quote:

Originally posted by elijah
True about google, although I have no complaints about the pop-up protection. How is it buggier? (in terms of major bugs, the minor stuff that gets reported to Mozilla but MS can afford to ignore).

Because I have it crash, hang, and become unresponsive far more often than IE. I also dislike how the scroll works while the page is loading, it's irratic and irritating.

Quote:

Netscapes closing down wont hurt Mozilla, because many developers have moved to Mozilla, and Aol will support Mozilla too. Financially, it looks good.

It looks good?? AOL gave them $2M...that's pocketchange.

And the Mozilla Foundation's press release stated they're hiring three of the 50 people laid off. How does this constitute "many"?

Hot Mustard · July 21, 2003, 21:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Asher
Because it takes way longer to load, doesn't support the Google Toolbar's (better) way of blocking popups, is still substantially buggier than IE, and its future is in doubt with last week's laying off of 50 of their software engineers.

Not to mention that the interface is noticably less responsive than IE.

Ahem. It was 50 Netscape engineers that got laid off.

Drake Tungsten · July 21, 2003, 21:19

Sahara kicks all their asses.

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:20

Quote:

Originally posted by dejon
Ahem. It was 50 Netscape engineers that got laid off.

Ahem. Who do you think develops 95% of Mozilla's code?

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Sahara kicks all their asses.

I'm sure if you say it enough, you'll believe it.

It still remains a second-rate browser with konqueror, Apple fans just have a weird ability to chant things to themselves and others and suddenly believe them.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:24

Quote:

Because I have it crash, hang, and become unresponsive far more often than IE. I also dislike how the scroll works while the page is loading, it's irratic and irritating

I dont find that, report it with your processor arch, OS and connection etc.

Quote:

It looks good?? AOL gave them $2M...that's pocketchange

I mean that financially, Mozilla is not dependent on Netscape/AOL.

Quote:

they're hiring three of the 50 people laid off

Ok, not many then, but better than a kick in the crotch!

Quote:

Ahem. Who do you think develops 95% of Mozilla's code?

Mozilla??

They have the code now, all they need to do is develop it. They have the three developers coming across now so that may maintain a netscape direction for a bit, but it is an independent browser, whose life is not dependent on netscape.

Besides, if your arguments were true, and Mozilla was in deep ****, dont you think that there would be a degree more concern in the FOSS circles?

Drake Tungsten · July 21, 2003, 21:25

Quote:

I'm sure if you say it enough, you'll believe it.

It still remains a second-rate browser with konqueror, Apple fans just have a weird ability to chant things to themselves and others and suddenly believe them.

Wasn't it an obvious joke, Asher? For god's sake, I didn't even name the browser correctly. Why don't you pull that stick out of your ass?

Sirotnikov · July 21, 2003, 21:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Asher
Because it takes way longer to load,

Wierd.

On my comp it takes 2 or 3 seconds to load, while IE often freezes for 2 or 3 seconds for no reason at all, reading my hard disk.

And no, I don't have spyware present

Quote:

doesn't support the Google Toolbar's (better) way of blocking popups

Maybe, but I have no doubt it will.

Anyhoo, I don't care, I use my own ad-blocker.

Quote:

is still substantially buggier than IE

Nope, can't share that thought. I have the most recent version of IE 6 + SP, and it still crashes, as often as once every couple of days.

Mozilla since version 1.2 didn't crash on me once.

Admittedly I used it less, but put it uner the same or more stress.

Quote:

and its future is in doubt with last week's laying off of 50 of their software engineers.

No it's not, since it's still an active community.

Nor should that be of any concern, because according to recent rumors, Microsoft will not make anymore IE versions, nor any further service packs. If you want a new version - get their future windows version.

Quote:

Not to mention that the interface is noticably less responsive than IE.

I know, but it has very much improved in 1.4. The main reason appears to be that Mozillla uses it's own API. I also find this annoying, but I understand their need for it, being cross platform and all.

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:28

Quote:

Originally posted by elijah
I dont find that, report it with your processor arch, OS and connection etc.

It happens on my P3 800, 384MB RAM, cable internet, WinXP SP1. It happens on my P4 2.53GHz, 1GB RAM, DSL internet, WinXP SP1. It happens on my UltraSparc II 450MHz, 256MB RAM, Solaris 8. It happens on my P3 800, 384MB RAM, cable internet, Linux 2.4.20...

Quote:

I mean that financially, Mozilla is not dependent on Netscape/AOL.

And where do they get their money, then?

Quote:

Mozilla??

They have the code now, all they need to do is develop it. They have the three developers coming across now so that may maintain a netscape direction for a bit, but it is an independent browser, whose life is not dependent on netscape.

Mozilla has funding to hire 3 programmers. That is, seriously, nothing. They relied on Netscape to do basically everything, overall design to implementation of the boring stuff the "freebie" volunteers never want to do.

Quote:

Besides, if your arguments were true, and Mozilla was in deep ****, dont you think that there would be a degree more concern in the FOSS circles?

It's been in the local papers here, it's been talked about on CNN, etc. FOSS circles probably don't want to admit that their vaunted, flagship open source software is going down the crapper.

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:29

Quote:

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Wasn't it an obvious joke, Asher?

In Canada, Drake, jokes tend to be funny.

For the life of me, I see no humour in your post.

Zopperoni · July 21, 2003, 21:29

Quote:

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Why don't you pull that stick out of your ass?

Maybe he likes having a stick up his arse

On-topic, I've grown so attached to Opera that I can't be arsed to switch (again).

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:32

Quote:

It's been in the local papers here, it's been talked about on CNN, etc. FOSS circles probably don't want to admit that their vaunted, flagship open source software is going down the crapper.

That would be the HURD!

Lets wait for a couple of months see if you are correct

Quote:

It happens on my P3 800, 384MB RAM, cable internet, WinXP SP1. It happens on my P4 2.53GHz, 1GB RAM, DSL internet, WinXP SP1. It happens on my UltraSparc II 450MHz, 256MB RAM, Solaris 8

I smell BS. It runs perfectly well on my P4 2.8GHz, 512Mb RAM, cable, Slackware9.0 and WinXP home box, although IE sometimes freezes and bumps out in XP. Cant be bothered to get crossover office so I cant test it on Linux

.

Drake Tungsten · July 21, 2003, 21:32

Quote:

Maybe he likes having a stick up his arse

I think you hit the nail on the head.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:34

Quote:

In Canada, Drake, jokes tend to be funny

I confess, there are days I wish I was Canadian. Still, sunny bloody England

Asher · July 21, 2003, 21:37

Quote:

Originally posted by elijah

That would be the HURD!

HURD? Give me a break.

The flagship OSS projects are Apache and Mozilla. HURD is way back there.

Quote:

I smell BS. It runs perfectly well on my P4 2.8GHz, 512Mb RAM, cable, Slackware9.0 and WinXP home box, although IE sometimes freezes and bumps out in XP. Cant be bothered to get crossover office so I cant test it on Linux

.

You smell BS? Mozilla is slow, buggy, and unresponsive on any platform.

Most people use Netscape 4.7 on the Solaris boxes at school because Mozilla 1.3 (haven't tried 1.4 at school yet), seriously, takes 15-20 seconds to load. It's ridiculous.

They all try to get on the WinXP boxes desperately (and this is compsci!).

Ned · July 21, 2003, 21:41

My two cents, I like, very much like, the text zoom feature of Mozilla and Netscape. IE and IE based browers have nothing comparable. By itself, this puts Mozilla in a class by itself for me.

As to speed, IE and Mozilla seem to be about the same for me. However, the IE engine is still required for some things. But there are other IE-engine browsers that also include some of advanced browser features that IE does not have, such as popup blocking and tabs:

Try the Slimbroswer. It is really good.

http://www.flashpeak.com/

I haven't tried Opera, so I have no opinion.

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:41

Quote:

Mozilla is slow, buggy, and unresponsive on any platform

...that you happen to use.

Mozilla is slow to load, its not unresponsive when loaded. I'm waiting for the faster stuff to get integrated. 1.5 is going to rule!!!

Whaleboy · July 21, 2003, 21:49

Asher, you really don't like open source software do you?

Sirotnikov · July 21, 2003, 21:57

Asher, any responses to my second post?