Chat 1 Save and Summary - Page 2

MattH · September 8, 2003, 16:45

To the long-term city site.
Are we going to try to do some variation of the circular city pattern "exploit"?

Panag · September 8, 2003, 17:35

Quote:

Originally posted by ormuzd
I don't think two squares more or less will result in the corruption of the new city because we don't have others.

And we can build panag's supercity later when it will be well protected. Building it now will leave us without gold (because the barb warrior will take it).

hi ,

we can spend the gold on research for now , ....

build the city before the barb kills the settler (!) cause otherwise we end with nothing , send a unit down to prevent a second barb from coming , voila , case solved , .......

have a nice day

Panag · September 8, 2003, 17:40

Quote:

Originally posted by 123john321
looks good,

now, about that 2nd city, I'll agree with panag, but try to build it on the coast, get the cattle, and 2 flood plans, if possbily, (I think to do thta, we maybe need to build on the cattle, which can't be good.)

hi ,

thanks for the insight

it shall be one the coast with the one ( 4 ) move , ....

ones a again it shall have ; one wheat , two plains , one cattle and one forest ( thats what we can see now )

since our current capital aint exactly usefull in its location we could use this supercity as our capital later one , ....

there seems to be an other island or con nearby ( unlikely since its near the bottom of the map ) with a wheat on it , as our culture expands so shall our view of that part of the world , ...

hence for all we know it might be a two tile island with one wheat on it , .....

have a nice day

Niessuh · September 8, 2003, 18:34

Quote:

Originally posted by MattH

To the long-term city site.
Are we going to try to do some variation of the circular city pattern "exploit"?

Ring City Placement?

GodKing · September 8, 2003, 19:36

We should be doing ring placement. I don't think of it so much as an exploit as just understanding how the game works.

Rhothaerill · September 8, 2003, 19:42

I agree. Not only is it a valid strategy and not an exploit, it will effectively cover the area of our peninsula with no land tiles wasted.

We must set up for the eventual war! The UOA will tear down every opponent in our way.

Jonny · September 8, 2003, 23:06

to ring city placement.

Octavian X · September 8, 2003, 23:08

The pretty ring looks good to me.

Minimal corruption, and good use of space. Barring another brilliant idea, I'd say go for it.

MattH · September 8, 2003, 23:16

Quote:

Originally posted by GodKing
We should be doing ring placement. I don't think of it so much as an exploit as just understanding how the game works.

I snuck "exploit" in quotes for just that reason.

Madcaptn · September 8, 2003, 23:34

Well I'm sort of a newb and I joined the C3DG with the primary goal of learning. What is that Ring thing you guys are talking about? I see that by placing cities closer to the capital will have less corruption but what are the other main advantages? and what's that 45 number all about.

MrWhereItsAt · September 8, 2003, 23:49

Madcaptn and others who are interested:

there have been some very dedicated peopl here and on Civfanatics who have spent considerable time testing for the equation that governs corruption in Civ3. They have found that equation to the degree of corruption with no more than 2% uncertainty. Corruption is made up of two parts: corruption due to the number of cities you have and corruption due to the distance from the capital/Forbidden Palace.

Part of the distance corruption for a city comes from considering the number of cities that are closer to the Palace than the one you are looking at. If you have several cities all at the same distance from the capital, they all have the same distance corruption. If you place 5 cities all at the same distance from the capital, there is only one city closer than them - the capital itself. If you ahve them at slightly different distances, however, you will have a ranking system - the closest city will have 1 city closer to the capital, then the next 2 cities, the next 3 etc....
In this case each city further out will have more and more distance corruption, whereas if they are all at the same distance they all have the same corruption due to the number-of-cities-closer-to-the-capital-than-this-city effect, and that will be the minimum.

Please note there are more things to consider than just this in calculating corruption for a city, but this is a good start in minimising it. In a few hours I may find the links in the Strategy forum where corruption and the equation that governs it is discussed.

ormuzd · September 9, 2003, 01:55

It seems this is the best strategy so far. Because I don't have the time to try it will be interesting to see how it works.

Madcaptn · September 9, 2003, 02:06

Quote:

Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
Madcaptn and others who are interested:

there have been some very dedicated peopl here and on Civfanatics who have spent considerable time testing for the equation that governs corruption in Civ3. They have found that equation to the degree of corruption with no more than 2% uncertainty. Corruption is made up of two parts: corruption due to the number of cities you have and corruption due to the distance from the capital/Forbidden Palace.

Part of the distance corruption for a city comes from considering the number of cities that are closer to the Palace than the one you are looking at. If you have several cities all at the same distance from the capital, they all have the same distance corruption. If you place 5 cities all at the same distance from the capital, there is only one city closer than them - the capital itself. If you ahve them at slightly different distances, however, you will have a ranking system - the closest city will have 1 city closer to the capital, then the next 2 cities, the next 3 etc....
In this case each city further out will have more and more distance corruption, whereas if they are all at the same distance they all have the same corruption due to the number-of-cities-closer-to-the-capital-than-this-city effect, and that will be the minimum.

Please note there are more things to consider than just this in calculating corruption for a city, but this is a good start in minimising it. In a few hours I may find the links in the Strategy forum where corruption and the equation that governs it is discussed.

cool thanks for the info

Niessuh · September 9, 2003, 04:08

Quote:

Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
In a few hours I may find the links in the Strategy forum where corruption and the equation that governs it is discussed.

CivFanatics' War Academy:
http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3acad_ring_city.shtml

CivFanatics' thread:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...threadid=57026

MrWhereItsAt · September 9, 2003, 08:29

Can't patronise another site when we have a lot of good info right here...

Everything you wanted to know about corruption

Additional Comments on Corruption

I have tonnes more links of useful little tidbits if anyone is ever interested.

GodKing · September 9, 2003, 12:45

Although the map above is a good start - there are several locations at the 4.5 mark of distance (for those who are curious - the diagnal movement counts as 1.5 in terms of corruption distance) that we should fill in also. Most of these cities will not be above size 3-6 for a LONG time, so lets get the max use of our land now when we need it most. In my own games, I like the first ring to be no further than 3 from the capitol because of the city size limitations.

G'Kar · September 9, 2003, 19:51

I think the RCP as illustrated by Niessuh is best for long term growth and will give us a useful second city quickly. I don't think we should be over concerned with using every available tile right now; we also have to think about expansion.

MrWhereItsAt · September 10, 2003, 06:18

Now here's something that has puzzled me: is it simply that you draw the shortest path between the Capital and the city, counting vertical/horizontal tiles as being = ditstance 1 and diagonals = 1.5, or do you actually calculate the distance?

Example: above we can reach the NW city with 4 tiles NW and one SW, which is equivalent to 3 tiles NW and one W.

If you calculate the exact geometrical distance to this city = SQRT(4^2 + 1^2) = SRT(17) = about 4.12, which is less than 4.5 I know that for a city this close and with as little trade/production as we will have, we need not worry about this, but, for the sake of the perfection of the formula (and my own happiness!) can anyone confirm for certain which of the two methods of calculating distance is the more exact one? This may be important later also - example

A city is located 15 tiles NW and 10 W of the capital. Using the "horiz/vert = 1, diagonals = 1.5" method, the distance is calculated at 30. Using the exact geometry method we find distance is 26.93. Not an enormous difference from the 1 and 1.5 method, but still perhaps enough to be concerned about if we find we are on an island map.

OPD · September 10, 2003, 06:56

WIA you are right the first time, it is not calculated by actual distance it is just the shortest path of adjacent/diagonal tiles with them being worth 1/1.5 respectively.

In the simplest terms say you wanted to move a warrior between 2 cities you would use the cursor keys to move the shortest and most direct distance. Every up, down, left or right button you press you add 1 and every diagonal button you press you add 1.5.

The good thing about RCP is that fractions are irrelevant. ie. cities of distance 4.5 and 4 are considered the same.

Niessuh's plan looks good and is probably the best use of the land. It would also be possible to have a city on the gems to the north at distance 4.

ormuzd · September 10, 2003, 11:16

usually I'm using the diagonals for moving units. Hitting 4 and 2 means 3 (2*1.5) but it is actually 2 (two times 1).

Alex (IIRC) have put exact math expression using min and max values for calculating the distance.

Panag · September 10, 2003, 18:01

Quote:

Originally posted by GodKing
We should be doing ring placement. I don't think of it so much as an exploit as just understanding how the game works.

hi ,

no tile shall be wasted neather when looking at the greater pic and placing cities in such a way that they max out on the resources , .......

we should not stick with one distance when for example right outside that ring lays some thing of greater value , ...... (!)

have a nice day

Togas · September 11, 2003, 00:24

Ring City Placement

Also note, I believe it is possible to pop that goodie hut by expanding the culture of a coastal city placed at either 8 or 8-8 of where the free settler is now.

--Togas

ormuzd · September 11, 2003, 03:10

culture means temple wit hthe cost of 3 archers or 6 warriors. Until then the city will grow beyond size 3 we will have problems with the unhappiness. IMO we should not care about the hut right now and focus on expanding.

Panag · September 13, 2003, 17:15

Quote:

Originally posted by ormuzd
culture means temple wit hthe cost of 3 archers or 6 warriors. Until then the city will grow beyond size 3 we will have problems with the unhappiness. IMO we should not care about the hut right now and focus on expanding.

hi ,

and the best for that would be to place that free settler where its the best , ...... it shall grow fast and produce fast , and no corruption shall be nothing compared to what we shall get from it , .......

as for that hut , we can always try later , for now its not that important ,........

have a nice day

Paddy · September 13, 2003, 21:31

Getting that Settler down and in a good producing area sounds sensible to me...

MrWhereItsAt · September 14, 2003, 07:49

We needn't worry about the hut anyway. We can get anything good including free techs from it until Invention, and no AI will land there, I think, as they can't place a city on a Mountain!

roadcage · September 17, 2003, 11:37

4,1,1,1
or
4,7,7,7
from New Asgard (numpad routing)

For a pic, jump to the link Nessiah provided with an earlier post. Both should be part of our long term plan.

We can argue over which to do first.

Ssgt roadcage (ret)

Paddy · March 27, 2004, 12:53

as we near 5000 years of Civilization...

let all know of our beginings...

lest we forget

Rasputin · March 28, 2004, 02:18

THANKS PADDY @@@@@@@@@

binyo66 · April 2, 2004, 03:09

What happen with this thread? That are some interesting tactics in the beginning.