Heavy Frustration...

Shadow Dweller · September 9, 2003, 08:36

this game seems not to like me. How is ya'll are able to get your civs into ind or even modern age by(in some cass I've seen) early 1500 and 1600 ?? Normaly I'm doing good if I can get ind age by around 1750-75, and JUST getting there. I love this game, but now that I see all of these people flying up the tech tree it's starting to realy get on my nerves that I'm always soo far behind the average player here. I'm new to this type of game by any means(haveing been play games from MoM up) But for some reason Civ3 just kicks my @$$ in ways most games don't. Is this a counter product of too many nights up playing MoO2 and MoM?? or the fact that I'm not on PTW yet(won't be till Conquests) Sort for the ramble, but I had to just say something.(besides the fact that anything over warlord kicks me in the ball)

bongo · September 9, 2003, 09:23

The people bragging in this forum about how early they can get to the industrial age isn't excactly what I would call 'average' players. More like 'very dedicated expert players', or 'anal retentive nitpickers'

If you want to join their ranks you have to read lots of posts, guides etc. and practice a lot. It takes time, you just have to ask youself it is worth it. If thats what you like, go ahead

I have come to the point where I can beat the crap out of the AI on monarch in over 90% of my games. I'm content with that, if I want to move up to emperor I have to change my playing style so much(read: go anal) that I probably will stop enjoying the game.

vmxa1 · September 9, 2003, 11:56

Shadow Dweller do not be concerned about when you get to what age. It is not important and is often a function of the game settings, start location and style of play.
Bongo had some good points. if you wan to be ace player and smash the game at the highest levels, you need to put lots of effort into mastering the game. This may not be all that satisfying to some. If you want to win at say Monarch level and are currently going fair at Warlord, you just need to improve on a few aspect of the game.
There is a topped thread that has the better strats linked. You can read a few of them and try to use some of those tactics.
You could also post a game and do some DARs as you play the game and get feedback. This is very useful.
All of this presupposes that you have enough interest to put the energy into it.
DAR is during action report. This is used in the AU games as vehicle to show what as occurred. You would post a start save and then a brief report on the actions taken up to the next break point. This could be at some point like 2950BC. If you go to far before a review, it is too late to make correction. A save and/or screen shots are used at the break points for reference.

Dominae · September 9, 2003, 12:18

Shadow Dweller,

apolyton.net (this site) has all the resources to help make you a better player. Read up on all the content that's been accumulating over the past couple of years, and you should be able to reach the Modern age by 1500AD easily. There is a topped thread on this forum that links to all the best strategy articles: if you plan on improving your game, that's a good place to start.

Dominae, apparently an "anal retentive nitpicker" because I beat the game on Emperor

alexman · September 9, 2003, 12:30

Shadow Dweller, it sounds like you might have been playing on Warlord or below with an unpatched version of Civ3. The tech rate at lower difficulty levels goes much slower without the latest patch, and it's normal to delay reaching the Modern Age.

Cort Haus · September 9, 2003, 13:18

The final Civ 3.0 patch - 1.29f, is the definitive version, and game balance is basically the same as PTW.

Experienced players hit the modern age in the 15/1600s because the tech rate is faster for the AI at higher levels, and the human player gets into this tech loop.

As Bongo said, Monarch is a fun way to smack the AI almost every time; above that requires much more careful management and allows few mistakes.

Shadow Dweller · September 9, 2003, 14:37

Quote:

Originally posted by alexman
Shadow Dweller, it sounds like you might have been playing on Warlord or below with an unpatched version of Civ3. The tech rate at lower difficulty levels goes much slower without the latest patch, and it's normal to delay reaching the Modern Age.

I've got the patch, at ;east it says I do on the opening screen and the CD

I know the AI doesn't research that fast on lower levels, but it shouldn't delay me 200-300 years, and then only reach the Ind Age. I might try playing on a harder level, who knows I might do better with higher diffuculty

bongo · September 9, 2003, 15:13

Dominae , you could call yourself 'very dedicated expert player' if you like that better, I know you qualify. No offense.

'Anal retentive nitpicker' were just to offer an alternative

I guess I qualify for that title sometimes, just don't in civ.

Shadow Dweller, start at the lower levels, read the guides or ask for help here and then work your way up

Shadow Dweller · September 9, 2003, 22:53

Bongo, I've been playing for quite some time(if you include Civ2). Who knows, I'm playing a regent game at the moment as an experiment. We'll see. Also are their any dar's that arn't for PTW?? I'd gladly try those.

fanes7 · September 10, 2003, 00:08

At beginning of game, before industrial age, you should not research any technology, the computer is far more fast than you , especially in more than 16 civs deity game. In a game like that , I sometimes can build university before 1000BC because the rapid research speed of the computer.

In a small map & less civs, I must research technology at very early age, for example , must research Write myself, It would be far more slow than the deity computers research speed.

vmxa1 · September 10, 2003, 01:10

Shadow Dweller there are a few pre PTW AU games, check the AU history thread for the list.

dexters · September 10, 2003, 01:11

Look at tech research as a chain. It can go as fast as the strongest chain in the link. If the AI has the lead, tech advancement is faster.

When I have the lead, human players will sit on their lead, doling out techs here and there for cash, but keeping their lead to essentially control the AI. If that is the case, the game can only progress as fast as you can research.

As vmxa1 noted, other settings, especially difficulty levels and # of civs, come into play here as well.

RE: Anal retentiveness

I think Civ is a game where people should be able to pick up on their own pace. Those at the front of the pack provide valuable insight into strategies, and game mechanics, but some of the prescribed strategies border on exploitation, and some people may already see it as out and out exploitation. I would say that not all of the optimal play strategies are for everybody. A lot of players out there abhours place jumps, because they see the historical capital as significant city and the cold calculation of jumping capitals simply breaks the aura of running a civilization for them. And I'll be the first to say I belong to that group.

As for reaching modern age early, if it is kept in context of a group of individuals who want to really push themselves, then great!. I think this is infact the case here.

The alternative is to impose an unwritten rule that sets out arbitrary dates and corresponding skill level. I don't think anyone here wants that. I also think the game becomes less fun for everyone out there who just wants pick up a few good strategies from the game leaders (you guys), but still want to play the game their way.

I get to the Modern Age in the 1600's-1700s in Monarch, with 16 civs and myself in the techlead. I'm confortable with it. I'm sure if the AI took the lead leading up to Modern Age, the world would get there faster, but that wouldn't help my grand plan to eslave the planet under my political, military and economic rule. aka the machiavellian geopolotiking

vmxa1 · September 10, 2003, 01:41

BTW if you mean by palace jump, where you abandon your palace and get a free palace some place, I do not do that either as I feel that is an exploit. It is not a game breaker or anything. So I don't care if others do it.
It is not on the level that the old forrest chops was.

dexters · September 10, 2003, 03:02

Yeah. I meant that.