îôìâú äîøëæ/Centre Party - Page 2

yaroslav · October 8, 2003, 16:25

I prefer to be in the military rather than in the Knesset

EmuGod · October 8, 2003, 17:34

You can't be in the military and in the knesset, Azazel, so you wil lremain number 3. Stalin II and I will end up in the knesset.

Az · October 8, 2003, 19:04

Spank you very much! I expect ending up being a military leader.*hint**hint*

Ok, now that the results of the elections are over, I think we must offer offer One Israel coalition with rotation in the place in the job of the prime minister. I say we put some very hard limits on the way things will be done in this war, according to our party line.

PinkyGen · October 9, 2003, 15:05

Apologies in advance on posting in your thread, but I need to finalize these coalition arrangements, and Emu hasn't been online in two days. This needs to get done soon, or else we risk not getting anything done until next week.

Az · October 9, 2003, 15:34

I am doing this only because neither Emugod, nor Stalin II are here....

I think my paper is a very nice line to hold as our coalition guidelines. If you want them to be more hawkish, I'll accept that our territorial goals and claims should be the real world 67' lines ( much more than what we currently have), plus East Jerusalem.

But still, primarily, our resources should be used to defend all current settlements from the incoming Arab army attack.

yaroslav · October 9, 2003, 16:02

PinkyGen, if you can't contact Emugod, please consider the pact signed as the term we spoke the last time...

conmcb25 · October 9, 2003, 16:11

Quote:

Originally posted by yaroslav
PinkyGen, if you can't contact Emugod, please consider the pact signed as the term we spoke the last time...

OK here I go, apologize for popping in your thread.

Now that we are actually being civil maybe we can relax that rule?

Anyway Yaro if you talk to Emu maybe he needs to appoint someone who can speak for him.

We want to move forward but we hesitate without Emu's or Emu's appointed guy to talk to.

I have authorization from Pinky to speak for One Israel.

Edit: I think your party needs to look at the Prime Ministers direction in the Cheif of Staff apply here thread. Azazel had issues with it but that is one member of your party. If you party has an issue we need to talk asap. We really need to getthat ironed out before the government moves forward. That "Strategic Direction" is our primary reason to exist as a government. If you dont like something please tell us now. But just remeber we had the majority of the votes so some drastic change will not be looked upon favorably.

Balls in your court Center, talk it out and let us know.

yaroslav · October 9, 2003, 16:19

I'm going to disconnect from Internet very soon, so I can't speak with Emugod. Emugod use to connect to MSN at this time, so if you've MSN on you probably will speak with him. If not, try to send him a PM or a letter

PinkyGen · October 9, 2003, 16:43

1. I did send a PM, just to confirm the arrangement we arranged (which btw isn't what Azazel's paper is). I have urged Emu to be Defense Minister over President because I think Defense has more authority than the President's position, which is mostly advisory. But if he wants Prez, it is his. I'll see if he shows up on AIM, but as you can see on the Chief of Staff Thread, I am proceeding.

2. Conmcb25 has authority to speak for me, especially since I am out of town Friday-Tuesday. We are working on setting up a pernament Press person over at One Israel, so someone else besides me can blab all the time.

3. I hope the strategic direction isn't that controversial, though I know Harmony would dislike it. I agree that expanding the Defense Perimeter is vague. It basically means a desire to take territory for the sake of giving us more territory so we can fall back when the Arab invasions start. I don't want Tel Aviv to be on the front. However, the priorities for actions are as I listed, trying to link up our territory.

conmcb25 · October 10, 2003, 22:00

About 72 hours +/-, still waiting for EMU.........

Tick Tock goes the never ending clock.

Well at least Ill get caught up in my PBEMs and maybe play some CIV 3.

I may quit CIV 2 altogether if I have to wait for EMU much longer......

Tick Tock goes the never ending clock.

Az · October 11, 2003, 08:46

@Emugod.

EmuGod · October 11, 2003, 15:29

I agree to take on the position of Defence Minister, but there are still a few minor details regarding foreign policy and other thigns that I wish to discuss before we commit to the government. I'm sure it won't take long.

BTW, conmcb25 get online!

conmcb25 · October 12, 2003, 00:05

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
I agree to take on the position of Defence Minister, but there are still a few minor details regarding foreign policy and other thigns that I wish to discuss before we commit to the government. I'm sure it won't take long.

BTW, conmcb25 get online!

Sorry I have relatives here this weekend. Send me a PM (or post it here) and make sure your box isn't full.

Is defense your final choice? I just want to make sure.

Let me know what your other issues are point by point.

Ill respond and lets get this thing going.

Thanks

EmuGod · October 13, 2003, 17:24

Here's what I pmed conmcb. I'm sharing it with you guys so you can see just how I am representing this party.

Here Are Some of My Thoughts on The Coalition:

1) I'll gladly be Defence Minister but since I am accepting the role of defence minister, I feel that I should be included in the choosing of Front commanders as a second opinion to the Chief of Staff.

2) Some of PinkyGen's war strategies are too hawkish. The Centre Party would like to suggest a list of targets which the IDF can attack for the safety of Israel. Any further targets that the military wishes to make would be left to a knesset vote which would need at least 80% to pass.

3) Most of my spending as Defence minister will be defensive which means city fortifications for all Israeli towns and appropriate defenders. No town should simply be abandoned.

4) The President should be elected by the rest of the knesset and should also get the added responsibility of purchasing weapons from the international dealers (occurs after the war starts).

5) The immigration minister should have the option of disbanding immigrants on his own and should be allowed to command naval vessels needed to convoy immigrant ships.

6) I would like yaroslav to be assured a position in the IDF as he has worked very hard to get this Democracy Game up and running.

7) Enjoy your holiday.

BTW, FiGu write a report on this in the newspaper thread.

Nilat · October 14, 2003, 10:17

Quote:

5) The immigration minister should have the option of disbanding immigrants on his own and should be allowed to command naval vessels needed to convoy immigrant ships.

Only some ships? And if some ships will be under my control who will choose what will I get?

PinkyGen · October 14, 2003, 14:18

First of all, the strategic direction was general guidelines of what I want a Chief of Staff to be willing to accept. This is opposed to say hiring a Chief of Staff who is pacifist.
I'm also somewhat upset by the broad range of points you listed. We had discussed this with both Yaro and you, and it seemed to me all was done, except for who would be Defense Minister. The longer we debate, the longer it is until the game starts.
I'll address the points.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod

Here Are Some of My Thoughts on The Coalition:

1) I'll gladly be Defence Minister but since I am accepting the role of defence minister, I feel that I should be included in the choosing of Front commanders as a second opinion to the Chief of Staff.

Ok with you as Defense minister. As for Front Commands, that is the Chief of Staff's responsibility, with input from us. However, we need not approve the final list. Anyway, Centre will be well represented in front commands, I believe you are already getting two fronts.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
2) Some of PinkyGen's war strategies are too hawkish. The Centre Party would like to suggest a list of targets which the IDF can attack for the safety of Israel. Any further targets that the military wishes to make would be left to a knesset vote which would need at least 80% to pass.

Explain how it's hawkish? It's link up the territory we have, capture East Jerusalem, defend the settlements, and use anything left over to take other cities.
You may propose a list, but tactical direction of the war is responsibility of the Chief of Staff, with input. As for adding targets requring 80% of the knesset, that is ridiculous. We are still debating this coalition, now we are adding more conditions? The military responds to our demands, but not everything they do can be voted on in the knesset. I can discuss specific cities, but it's not even specifically my duty, it is the Chief of Staff.

If you disprove of something, bring this up the Chief of Staff. If you feel are you are being ignored, bring it up to me. If you feel like I ignore you, then you can stay or leave in the coalition. But we musn't harmstring the military by voting on whether to take a city or not, it's ridiculous.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
3) Most of my spending as Defence minister will be defensive which means city fortifications for all Israeli towns and appropriate defenders. No town should simply be abandoned.

You do not control disposition of defenders, Chief of Staff does. And yes, you could build a ton of defenses, but remember we need military units, and not every city needs a city fortification if there is not much threat to it. Keep in mind also Econ Minister must approve rushbuys.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
4) The President should be elected by the rest of the knesset and should also get the added responsibility of purchasing weapons from the international dealers (occurs after the war starts).

It's a little late to do that, and you are adding powers to the President he should not have. It's largely ceremonial, and the way you seemed to be seeking the post earlier, it seemed as though it would be included in coalition negotiation, not dealt with seperately. If you wanted to rewrite something like this so drastically, you should have done it a while ago, not now. I assumed since you would not take President, One Israel would appoint the President for it's largely ceremonial role. Do not overcomplicate this, people are already getting confused on the rules.

Econ Minister obviously gets the task of buying arms.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
5) The immigration minister should have the option of disbanding immigrants on his own and should be allowed to command naval vessels needed to convoy immigrant ships.

Defense Minister's responsibility, since he is deciding what to build. Since you are Defense Minister, you may decide to let your fellow Centre party member do the job, but do it effeciently.

Quote:

Originally posted by EmuGod
6) I would like yaroslav to be assured a position in the IDF as he has worked very hard to get this Democracy Game up and running.

This was already discussed, he's getting the front he wants, in addition to I believe Azazel as well.

And thanks for wishing me a happy holiday.

I'm willing to alter the strategic direction thread, since I don't consider it that important. My general idea is this

1. Support offensive action so all of our cities will be linked together, and not be seperated by Arab territory.
We need to relieve some of our far off settlements. While we should not defend these places at all costs, we should make attempts to open road routes so we can send reinforcements. Additionally, some of our larger towns in the Galilee are cut off by Arab towns.
2. Be willing to expand our defensive perimeter.
3. Maintain our control of West Jerusalem, and have a plan to allow access to the holy Old City once more by capture of East Jerusalem.
4. In addition to the above 3 reasons to capture Arab cities, be willing to capture or bribe Arab cities for the purposes of using their infrastructure to aid our economy and production.
5. Be mindful that in 5-6 turns, the British leave, and we must be prepared to resist the full fury of the Arab attack.

Obviously, this will involve coordinating with front commander, but the Chief of Staff will select front commanders, but be amendable to suggestions from above.

conmcb25 · October 14, 2003, 14:28

Well it sounds like my boss and I are are on the same track. As you can see from my PM's this morning, EMU.

Since Im the task-master for One Israel, we are going to wait 24 hours for a reply. Because Im a buthole. (Well I am but that is not really the reason) The real reason is that everyone wants to get playing this, we have been messing around with this for months. So 24 hours and then we just move forward.

Its just not fair to the others to make them wait.

Lets agree on a strategic direction, and then work the details as we go.

Major issues (such as how the president gets into office) should really be put to a poll. But right now I say we go with what was agreed to in the Poll: PinkyGen's Laws. We virtually all agreed to it. So lets just do it.

thanks

have a nice day

Nilat · October 14, 2003, 15:16

Can the defence minister give the immigration minister ships to protect the transports for my own use? (only for defence of course)

conmcb25 · October 14, 2003, 15:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Stalin II
Can the defence minister give the immigration minister ships to protect the transports for my own use? (only for defence of course)

I see this as a minor issue that can be worked out. In theory I dont have a problem with it , if it makes the game go smoother.

Lets agree on the Strategic Direction first or else we wont have a coalition!

PinkyGen · October 14, 2003, 15:56

To echo my number 2,

If the Defense Minister wishes to cede that task to you, that is alright, though I may change in my mind in the unlikely event that I think it is hampering operations.

PinkyGen · December 16, 2003, 22:11

Butting in on your party thread again, sorry.

It's only two turns before elections, but if Centre wishes, they can appoint someone to Defense Minister since Emu is AWOL and it gives One Israel near Monopoly to have Conmcb25 play Defense Minister.

yaroslav · December 17, 2003, 07:22

Well, the thing is that we have 5 members, 3 on the military, 2 on the parlament. There is nobody else in the party.

If Stalin II wants to be both minister of Inmigration and Defense is up to him, but the other members of the party are in the army, so they can't be ministers.

PinkyGen · December 17, 2003, 17:48

He can't double up. He could take over Defense if he wants, but he cannot hold both jobs. We do have elections coming up soon, so I am not sure if it is worthwhile to juggle the positions around, but I felt it was a duty to let you know your options.

yaroslav · December 18, 2003, 07:47

Thanks

EmuGod · December 27, 2003, 12:43

Alright, seeing that elections are coming up, we need to come up with a good campaign to try and draw more votes to our party. We should pm each other with ideas on what to do for our election campaign and discuss the possibility of shuffling around our party list (if you guys think we should).

Nilat · December 27, 2003, 16:00

So if one israel wins the elections again, we will possibly keep these old positions? (Emugod as Defence minister, me as the immigration minister)

What if we wont have positions in the knesset after the elections, what will happen to us?

yaroslav · December 27, 2003, 17:01

There are too much things to do... We should ask ourselves is we have done the best for the country!!! Where have we imposed our politicis (if we have our own politics)? In what aspect of the game are we different from One Israel party? I mean, One Israel is for a FULL WAR expansion, Harmony Party is for BRIBING and we are for something in the MIDDLE, but we haven't take any measures to control how we're expanding.

Also, under this administrations some citiziens have set themselves in "I-don't-believe-in-this-system" mode (ie - they haven't post in the forum lately). Plus, the Harmony party is out of any position of power.... And they are supported by many citiziens all over the country.

So, somethings are to be set for our next campaign. Wherever we govern in solo mode or in a coaliction, it's mandatory, IMHO,

1) To attract more citiziens to the game and to recover the lost citiziens. The goverment should write reports to be published in the Civ2 section!!!

2) To give a role to the Harmony Party... Maybe the Presidency of the nation as it's not very powerful and by doing so we'll put them also in the war effor - in a time where all hands are welcomed.

3) To lobby against any expansion into Syria and Egypt...

4) To get a compromise from the govt that all the Kibuzt are going to be defended.

5) To work out a system to improve the comunications between the ministers and the military.

That's all - for now.

Az · December 27, 2003, 17:13

I have no problem expanding into the Golan Heights, if we'll be able to do it.

EmuGod · December 27, 2003, 18:50

I think our best for a political campaign would be to target the current mistakes of the government such as the failure of the economic minister to fully set up a taxing system to get as much money as possible. I think our target list idea of the last time was an effective way to moderate both sides of the expanstionist and defensive spending.

I think we need to try and get as many votes as possible and then try to form a coalition with either of the parties. I think what sets us aside is our centrist policy which will bing us into any coalition government since Harmony and One Israel would be very reluctant to form a government with each other.

yaroslav · December 27, 2003, 19:28

We're part of the govt... Isn't a little strange to whine about the govt when we were part of it?

And... are there citiziens that aren't members of any party? Because, with all the citiziens being part of the parties there is no campaign we can do...

Centric is very good and I believe in it

But we can't see it just as a way of getting votes from the left and the rigth - it's mandatory that we work our politics... I think that we're falling to close to One Israel... Could a citizien differentiate between us and them? If not, what does this party stand for?