Eager to return - Page 3

deity · October 2, 2003, 03:42

That smallEarth scn is mid game btw. Dang made mods as we went along I think?

Ljube · October 2, 2003, 03:51

Quote:

Originally posted by OzzyKP
Ok, here is a list of everyone's availability so far. If anyone can add more times to this list (or players) it'd be excellent. All times USA Eastern.

Frank - Any weeknight except Thursday, and Sunday all day
Deity - Weds, Thurs, Fri or Sat night
Prom - Thurs night
Raz - Flexible
Ozzy - Any weeknight but after 9 on Friday, Sat night, not Sunday night.
Llejo - Weekends

I can host, but I'm on dial-up so I better not.

I suppose from the context that I'm Llejo.
Well, it's quite simple really.
In ICQ I'm Ljube which is a nickname based on my first name (Ljubisa).
My full name is Ljubisa Cvetkovic, hence my login here.

Yes, just like Ozzy said, I work all weekdays and USA weekday nights are European early mornings, so quite difficult.
But weekend is fine. For a game like this I'll adjust weekend activities.

The changes that increase the significance of useless wonders (there are quite a few of those) are simply great. I love the idea of Suez and Panama canals. We could extend this to other things including all useless/forbidden wonders. And yes, probably difficulty level lower than deity would spur expansion (in my current diplo I have only 8 cities and already suffering the effects of first unhappy citizen

).

Ecthy · October 2, 2003, 04:55

Anyone fancy a game with me at some point? haven't played in some time, but I used to be infamous

Not... never got around to playing online too much actually... but I did have Ming sub for me (with Empress in betwween) at one point... that made me proud

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 06:47

Quote:

Originally posted by OzzyKP
"but Arab tribe might be fun. PErhpas ancient arabs pre palestine, so the Canaanites or some such thing."

When I played the Arabs in HOTW3 I started at 96,58 and made my capitol Mecca. Bunch of desert there, but 3 specials, so its a decent spot. Would that work for you?

sound perfect , without actualy knowing where 96,58 is LOL , but i am here for the excitement , not for the winning ....

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 06:52

Quote:

Originally posted by deity
I can do ANY USA Weds, THurs, Fri or Sat night (NOT this Fri though).

USA mornings are not good.

ozzy, I'll have a think about my locale.

Who's hosting?

Hi Dang

i got ADSL so i can host, but still scouring 2nd hand shops for a civ 2 CD .....

Ecthy · October 2, 2003, 07:15

As long as Eyes isn't in the game as well or, even worse, hosts it...

I've got DSL too, BTW

rah · October 2, 2003, 08:23

Ecthelion, you could post your interest here too.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...4&pagenumber=4

Ecthy · October 2, 2003, 08:34

I might, thanks. That is I WILL, if there's a lot of chitchat going on

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 09:13

This is the map we are gonna be using. Same as HOTW2 except I closed the canals.

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 09:17

Quote:

Originally posted by deity
So let's kich off this USA Sat night? Convince Prom and Empress that it's in their intersts, besides, it's my b'day

And I'm p!ssed

I think we need to convince Frank too.

So what say you all? Will Saturday nights work? Who needs a social life anyways, play civ with us!

Ecthy · October 2, 2003, 09:39

You can have a social life at friday night

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 10:23

this weekend no good. still no CD folks ... geez someone HELP !!!!!!!

wonders why he threw out Civv 2 disc .... ?? oh yeah civ 3

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 10:35

Ok, looks like its unanmious that we go with the wonder linked canal event, increase ship movement, and play on Emperor. It also looks like we have a starting line up. Still need questions of time, civ and mod adjustments.

Deity--Can do Sat night, Africa somewhere, yes to Frank's mod, yes to open Australlia (i'm guessing)
Raz--Can do Sat night, Arabs, mod?, Australlia?
Ljube-- Can do Sat night, civ?, mod?, Australlia?
Ozzy--Can do Sat night, English, yes to mod, no to open Australlia
Prom--Saturday?, civ?, mod?, Australlia?
Frank --Saturday?, Chinese, yes to mod, Australlia?
Ecthelion --Saturday?, civ?, mod?, Australlia?

The mod is what Frank & Deity were discussing. Changing fundy to fascism, adding dreadnaughts, adding infantry, changing fanatics to stormtroopers, and I recommend changing theology to Islam and monotheism to Christianity.

I've also put the question out there about opening up Australlia for someone to pick. I think it was a bit unbalancing in HOTW2 to have Deity isolated down there while everyone else fought for territory on the mainland. And in HOTW3 Australlia was left empty. However I just remembered in HOTW3 we only had 6 players, so space could be tight in HOTW4. It can certainly be done though. 2 in Africa, 2 in Europe, 1 Mideast, and then China & India. Should be plenty of room for us to make a decent homeland, and then lots of open land available for colonization. I figure rubbing elbows is what makes Diplogames interesting anyways, if we have too much room there is the risk of becoming a boring building game.

I encourage y'all to vote no to Australlia. But since its 7 instead of 6 I wouldn't put of a fight if y'all wanted to open it.

People still need to pick what civ/character they want to be. Frank has chosen Chinese, I have chosen English, and Raz has chosen Arabs. Deity wants Africa somewhere, but I suspect he'd go to Australlia if the option were available. So we deffinately need someone in Eastern Europe (like Russians or Greeks or something). And another in Africa and Asia. The map is posted so give me your starting location too.

Fill in the blanks.

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 10:46

Btw to help spark people's imagination regarding civ choosing.

Europe - Hungarians, Polish, Russians, Greeks, Serbs (Ljube?), Swedes, Norwegians, Ukranians

Africa - Zulu, Ethiopians, Mali, uhh..

Asia - Indians, Khmer (in Thailand), Mongols(moved a bit westward so as not to overlap Chinese)

Ljube · October 2, 2003, 10:51

I'll be Serb (that's Europe). I'll supply the list of cities and titles and the leader's name will be Slobodan Milosevic.

Yes to mod.

No to Australia (sorry deity no birthday present this time).

Frank Johnson · October 2, 2003, 12:15

I can play on saturday nights, its just in the event I'm forced to work on that particular night the weekly event could get delayed untill 10:30pm EST or so. The Aussies probably wouldnt mind but I dunno about the rest.

I'm going to try to line up some more mod ideas so they can be discussed better.

My mod previously in the first game was a no wonder game, except for Apollo and Manhattan Project. That can be changed back quickly since no one's even mentioned a no wonder game.

Units
Stormtroopers, nil, 0, 1.,0, 7a,5d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, Fun, (replace fanatics)
Infantry, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,5d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, Too,
(replace apline troops)
Stlth Ftr., nil, 1, 14.,1, 8a,5d, 2h,2f, 8,0, 3, Sth,

Stlth Bmbr., nil, 1, 12.,2, 15a,6d, 2h,2f, 16,0, 0, Sth, (these 2 have just be powered up a bit)
Man-o-War, E1, 2, 4.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,2, 2, Mag, (replaced Frigate)
Battle Cruiser, Roc, 2, 5.,0, 6a,6d, 3h,2f, 8,0, 2, Aut, (replaces cruiser, pushed back to aut, to make dreadnought age)
Modern Infantry, nil, 0, 1.,0, 8a,6d, 3h,1f, 6,0, 5, Pla, (a late game anti-howie unit, it has the +50% vs 2 move tag)
Jet Bomber, nil, 1, 10.,2, 13a,4d, 2h,2f, 14,0, 5, U1,

Jet Fighter, nil, 1, 12.,0, 6a,4d, 2h,2f, 7,0, 3, U1, (these 2 are available with jet aviation, which is between rocketry and space flight)

Dreadnought, nil, 2, 4.,0, 8a,8d, 3h,2f, 10,0, 2, Ref,

Fascism was available in the same place as fundy, gives you 5 free units per city, and reduced your science output 30%.

This mod had an altered tech rate, but I have reduced that to normal unless it is agreed on. I've also removed the mods to make cities smaller and take longer to grow. Since the map is huge there's no sense in trying to slow down expansion.

Which wonder or wonders will activate the canals? Just tower? Or tower and?

Ship speed increases?
Nasty ultra barbarians in the new world?
Alien invasion at the end?
Increased spy and diplo cost?

Ljube · October 2, 2003, 12:58

Frank Johnson, this is just wonderful

Ship speed increase - yes except for trireme

Increased spy and diplo cost - yes

Nasty ultra barbarians in the new world - YES YES YES

Alien invasion at the end - don't know (could be nice but difficult to dimension properly)

Prometheus · October 2, 2003, 13:52

Sigh, I do like my social life on Saturday. What time are we looking at, if we make it a late game, or if we make it an late afternoon game I should be good…. Say 3 to 7 or 11 to 3 or something like that. Give me something to work with here.

Don’t care about Aussie land, though, the West will have less land than the east. If it is just India and China; that gives China a huge advantage still if you ask me.

Raz, do you still have the game downloaded on your computer, if that’s the case just use the CD hack… shhh, I dont think were suppose to mention it though.

Ship speed increases = sure
Nasty ultra barbarians in the new world = No: because if there were ultra barbarians in the New World in HOTW2 I would not of been able to make a come-back, if someone is behind the new world could be used as political leverage for them.
Alien invasion at the end = Don’t really care for it, but whatever you guys decide is for me.
Increased spy and diplo cost = sure

Also I don’t care about most of the new units they are all fine, I don’t want specific civ units though. I suggest original tech rate.

As for my civ, I will let Ecthelion decide which bastards he would like to deal with first and then take the left over position.

BTW, I am gone for the weekend starting tonight, so Happy Birthday Deity, and I will see you all next week

edit: which witch is which... I am an idiot....

Prometheus · October 2, 2003, 13:54

and I can host if need be....

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 14:59

Quote:

Originally posted by Prometheus

Raz, do you still have the game downloaded on your computer, if that’s the case just use the CD hack… shhh, I dont think were suppose to mention it though.
....

no new computer so game not loaded

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 15:06

For the canal activators I'm thinking Canal and SETI. Only because SETI comes so late in the game its probably not going to be very useful. Although, could we use a wonder twice in the game? Like use the SETI spot for the Panama Canal, and after its built just switch the SETI spot back to normal. Since the canal wonder is just a one time thing I suppose it could be done if we really wanted it. But I'm in favor of just scrapping SETI.

I dunno about all the units though. Its cool to add a few, but thats a long list of new units, I'm just worried of things being potentially unbalancing. What do y'all think?

As for the Alein invasion thing, if we'd want a real challenge we'd need to have a human controlling the aliens, in which case we'd only be able to have a 6 player game like HOTW3. I'd very much prefer 7 players. But if y'all think an AI barbarian horde of super powerful Alein forces would be a good ending, then sure.

I'm good with increasing diplo and spy cost. Cause I'd like to keep city bribe in the game. Usually people outlaw it, but I think it is good in the game and for diplogaming. However we certainly don't want it abused, so making the units much more expensive is a good trade off. If we don't allow city bribe, then only a small cost increase should be done.

I could do 11pm-3am on Sat-Sun if necessary. Though 10-2 would be much better for me. But if thats critical to having Prom in, I could deal with dazed Sundays from now on

What coordinates do you want to start with Ljube?

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 15:08

ok , ,

i think 2 civs in africa , 2 in europe 2 in asia is more than enough , last time we had 2 in africa, one in europe, one in mideeast, 2 in europe and one in australia.

Deity had [plenty of room to expand and fill australia unimpeded , even though a lot of australia was worthless compared to land elsewhere, but very good loand compared to mid east start.

If we go for no civ in australia will have to make sure the 7 civs are spread out enough across africa europe asia to allow some starting space.

So a msut as i said above is 2 Africans, North and south, 2 Europenss (I think ozzy wante d England so that is one) and another civ somewhere in far eastern europe, Russia might be better than serbia..

Then me in mid east, China over to the far east and a third somewhere like india.

Rasputin · October 2, 2003, 15:12

Units
Stormtroopers, nil, 0, 1.,0, 7a,5d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, Fun, (replace fanatics)
Infantry, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,5d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, Too,
(replace apline troops)
Stlth Ftr., nil, 1, 14.,1, 8a,5d, 2h,2f, 8,0, 3, Sth,

Stlth Bmbr., nil, 1, 12.,2, 15a,6d, 2h,2f, 16,0, 0, Sth, (these 2 have just be powered up a bit)
Man-o-War, E1, 2, 4.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,2, 2, Mag, (replaced Frigate)
Battle Cruiser, Roc, 2, 5.,0, 6a,6d, 3h,2f, 8,0, 2, Aut, (replaces cruiser, pushed back to aut, to make dreadnought age)
Modern Infantry, nil, 0, 1.,0, 8a,6d, 3h,1f, 6,0, 5, Pla, (a late game anti-howie unit, it has the +50% vs 2 move tag)
Jet Bomber, nil, 1, 10.,2, 13a,4d, 2h,2f, 14,0, 5, U1,

Jet Fighter, nil, 1, 12.,0, 6a,4d, 2h,2f, 7,0, 3, U1, (these 2 are available with jet aviation, which is between rocketry and space flight)

Dreadnought, nil, 2, 4.,0, 8a,8d, 3h,2f, 10,0, 2, Ref,

These numbers ar emeaningless to me, i never understood them when i saw them in the rules.txt file the first time so they not mean anything now.

some one please give me a lay mans terms explanation of these all.

I have played civ 2 SP with fascism patch and that was excellent. So if your mod includes that i am for it

Frank Johnson · October 2, 2003, 15:32

Storm Troops are pseudo offensive infantry, they cost 50 sheild, move 1 and defend as well as other industrial age infantry units. They can take out unfortified units in the feild well and cost nothing under facsim to support.

Infantry are just slightly downgraded apline tools, that come with machine tools (thus machine guns). They dont get the road move, but have better attack.

Stealth Bombers and fighters are just buffed a little to keep them different from the new jet fighters and bombers.

Man-o-Wars are frigates with +1 defense.

Battlecruisers are cheap battleship alternatives that come with automobile.

Modern Infantry are slow mech inf replacements, but they are the best defense against howitzers since in theory they get a +50% defense bonus against them.

Jet fighters and bombers are just upgraded fighters and bombers that come with jet aviation between rocketry and space flight.

Dreadnought come out with refining, the same time as submarines and better reflect the era of big gun warships. They are good for bombardment and owning ironclads.

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 16:33

Still seems like a lot, but I'm game. Put 'em in if no one objects.

deity · October 2, 2003, 20:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Rasputin

no new computer so game not loaded

I'll zip it up for you Raz. We know you bought the game so that should not be a problem. But you'll still have to sort out the c@#$k...

deity · October 2, 2003, 20:33

This all sounds great guys!

Spys must be expensive.

Post the scn ASAP so we can test it out; double check the mods and rules.txt etc.

Maybe a few of us should MP it?

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 20:41

Any more word on the events?

I checked the events editor in civ and I didn't see an option for linking them to wonders, so hopefully someone knows how and can set that up. It'd be great to have stuff ready for a pilot run this Saturday, just to test out the mods.

Frank Johnson · October 2, 2003, 20:56

Ill take a look at the events editor when I get home. I know you can activate an event when a tech is researched, but I don't know about wonders. We could just have the canals open up with the invention of the steam engine, or rails, or industrialization.

Try to get a list together of the nationalities and starting locations so I can put together the modpack by tomarrow and put it up on the website. The mod is pretty much made, I just have to pound out the starting locations and events as well as restore the wonders to their normal preqs.

OzzyKP · October 2, 2003, 21:10

Ok, i've asked the experts:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=98392