Turns 2141-2160

[Googlie]

Originally posted by FlameFlash
it sounds about on Borg play level and I don't want to appear dishonorable.

The only rules restriction is "no base trading with the AI" (mainly because they will often accept a totally one-sided trade in bases)

Gifting a base to the AI is permissable (as would be subsequently mind-controlliong it back, or probe-raping it)

G.

[FlameFlash]

I don't care if it's 'permissable' it still seems very dishonorable and unjust so I'm glad the time for that option has passed.

[Makahlua]

Well, SeaLurk -and- Casablanca have been pwn3d by the Borg as well this turn :/

Now what? I am lost as for what to do to keep us in

forgot, we also had a message from archaic in the chat box that he'd feel like trading, but i dont' know if it's in time *sigh*

[FlameFlash]

oh goody...

[Hercules]

Well MAki there is not an awful lot to do.

At HMB After the Dock guy, build a barque ( as Cuspidore BB suggested.)
Likewise at Atlantis.

Move SF at 49, 57 towards Bones Island via a back way maybe into 48,50 ( fungus) or to the left of fungus to try and get working off Bones Island.

Near Li'l A build sensor with that former( 37,69)
maybe.

Move former on dead scout island to near formerly Sealurk ( to see what's in the base now)

Pop a pod on the yard arm. Hope for ecs. If over 100ecs see if Miriam will sell Non linear.

The foil probe from Liar's Lair next turn, I feel will have to try and steal Non lInear or HEC from Roze. (12/13 tiles away).

Meanwhile I 'll try and find out what the score with the Hive. Doc: Loyalty would also help.

I 'll contact Archaic as to what he has in mind. We need Biogenetics from somewhere so that when we probe Roze we don't steal that.

The Hive seem not to have obtained HEC or Non linear

[johndmuller]

You might want to do some scorched earth stuff with the land and sea formers that are trapped in our old territory - i.e. un-terraform some stuff.

OTOH, it might be just as good to disband/destroy them to save a few buckaroonies at Liar's, where they are currently being supported from.

Same possibilities apply to the former near Sealurk (plus Herc's idea or using it for intel and the riskier alternative of trying to rescue it with the booty-boat). I guess I would be in favor of ditching it and saving the maintenance cost.

Please do something constructive (for a change) with the formers on HMB - that road at (37,69) was the next best thing to useless (and recommended against several times); perhaps foresting that tile as long as your're there; if we already had that forest, we wouldn't have an underutilized crawler and an imminent underutilized worker.

Build Barques at Pamplona and Atlantis and at HMB next time - although we also need to build defensive probes ASAP (yes, I'm a broken record about that - at the very least, build one at Accident and send it to HMB). Noone addressed the question of whether there is an in-port defensive penalty with the barques, but they are otherwise a much better bet than the Dock Patrols as they cost the same and have the added benefits.

The new Colony Pod at Calico, if we manage to build it, can supposedly leave the seabase without a transport if there is already another unit ashore where it wants to go. I imagine that this is a programming oversight rather than an intentional feature, but I believe that it is legal to do it and our situation is desperate enough for me. So, you should continue moving the rover to get it to whereever it needs to be in (hopefully 2 turns). Given that the forest at (58,42) should finish next turn, we should produce just enough mins to be able to finish it if we don't spend our money anywhere else and if you shift the worker to that tile instead of (56,44) now, or next turn at the latest.

I'm in favor of whatever trades and deals that can be made.

[FlameFlash]

Don't forget you can also self-destruct formers... they supposedly do do okay damage when blown up.

Tass is also looking for authorization to our board. Who has that power?

[johndmuller]

(after looking at the midturn)

Too bad we got that (not independent) rover from the pod (I suppose), now it will take an extra turn to produce the CP from Calico unless we get extra $ from somewhere else; I should have given you a rabbit's foot for Christmas.

Put =Stockpile Energy= in the queue at HMB instead of the Dock Patrol (extra free energy upon completion of the Barque - only if =Stockpile Energy= is the sole item in the queue when a unit completes).

Put =Stockpile Energy= in the queue at Liar's instead of all that stuff (same reason).

Put =Stockpile Energy= in the queue (or just take remove the Dock Patrol) at Accident (similar reason, although when building facs the =Stockpile Energy= is inserted into into queue by default if it is empty; non-empty queues after facs don't get the free energy).

Maybe this extra energy will be enough to be able to rush the CP next turn after all.

Other bases should have it in the queue too, instead of those extra build items, but as they are not completing next turn, it is not urgent, but you might as well get it out of the way lest it get forgotten. (begin diatribe) Personally, I wish they had fixed the 'feature', especially as the current consensus seems to be to go out of the way to reap the undeserved benefits despite the fact that it is an obvious bug, rather than make the same effort to avoid taking advantage of the exploit (or even the least effort intermediate policy of refraining from intentionally inserting it after units). (end diatribe)

[foolish_icarus]

well ****

[Hercules]

Not much more to add

Just cancell the automatic on the schooner (PHS Lair's Liar?) jus in case you want to pause before popping the sea pod.

Also cancell the automatic on the rover on Yard arm. There'a another pod there hiding above the former, May be worth popping next time.

You may wish to park the displined schooner in Atlantis near the other sea pod.
at 58.40 is it; for next turn, we need the goodies.

[Makahlua]

Liar's fell this turn; the booty boat in Pamplona is headed either to
atlantis or calico to grab a pod. Is there much else we can do? The boot is sure to be the next target :/

[johndmuller]

Looks like we are being steamrolled in the war; I don't hold out much hope for avoiding extinction, although If we might be able to get away with a CP, although I don't see the logistics working out too well, unless someone gives us a lot of P's of E to build a Sea Colony.

As to the turn:

I would rush the CP at Calico with all 13 of our P's of E;then see if we could get a SeaCP built there somehow to sail into Hiveland with. Move the rover at (60,44) to (57,43) - the new CP should be able to disembark from the SeaBase onto that tile - it could then proceed to (59,41) for a new base site. After building that we base, we could pop that pod at (58,40), having put first put the best military unit possible into the build queue hoping to get it for free. I don't know if we could survive any better on that island than on HMB, and I don't know how we could get away to Hiveland from there unless they help with financing and/or transportation, but ...

I doubt that we can do anything useful on the west, although we may be able to occupy them a little longer on that front as Accident is not on the coast and we might get a shot of our own in after they start their attack. With a lot of luck, we might be able to build a Sea Colony at Atlantis - perhaps getting it for free if it were in the queue when we pop the pod at (37,55). Or we could switch to a regular CP and try to get away with the transport before they come for us there (unlikely to happen soon enough, but ...).

[Hercules]

Some ideas combine with JDM.

At Pamplona, rush Barque, sell energy bank

L'il Accident

In design workshop, design laser squad,( Is that Dock police)

Put Laser squad in Q, then pop sea pod

If successful, then place another laser squad in queue (next turn after Stockpile), sell rec com facility.



If ecs from sea pod, pop other pod near Li'l Acc with crawler
Convert nutrient crawler ( 35,69) to min crawler
If ecs total 100 + try Miriam to buy non linear.

At HMB sell rec com
Build laser squad ( 2-2-1)
move former into base as another unit to defend

From Atlantis change build to sea colony pod

Then pop pod at 37,55 with disciplined schooner. If successful then get ready to run asap Sea Cp towards Hive territory Also if succesful , after Stockpile in queue place party boat in queue next turn with view to rush with cashing crawlers. Still aim to get Non linear. if we purchase non linear then maybe HEC.

If no luck with completion of sea colony pod at Atlantis, move transport to 43.53 allowing us to pick up rushed cp next and/or head to Calico

At Calico do more or less as JDM suggests maybe sell facility and rush Cp sell pressure dome
Depending on other outcomes try to avoid popping pod at 58,40 until next turn.

Disband former attached to Atlantis and move Pamplona former to base.

Next turn we must be prepared to send our maps and tech to the Hive.

Will ask Hive for Biogene. We need to send Doc Ini to Hive so that they can build protective sea craft to assist us

[Makahlua]

OK here's what I did:

Sold the energy bank @ Pamplona, giving back 40 PoE which was more than enough to rush the barque there and JDM's CP @ Calico. Rover is in position @ (57,43). I sent the other rover toward the black on Yard arm, there is another pod up there we can also pop.

Success with the pod and laser squad! Scrapped all Rec coms for cash, that gave me drones in all cites 2+ pop, so I've allocated all labs money to psych to compensate. Can't get minerals at that farm spot, I'm sending it to the rocks other side of LA.

No luck with Atlantis pod, we got kelp *grumbles* That 'sport just left Pamplona this turn, won't move again until next turn. Successfully purchased Non: Linear from Miriam (damn I shoulda done that backwards; scrapped facilites, got non linear -then- made the prototypes *sigh*)

Shall I add our maps to that Doc:Ini offering?

[Hercules]

No don't send maps yet until we hear more detail and acknowledgement from Octavian or Voltaire.
Yeah Damn about non-linear. Maybe we can sell it for cash to the PUT or Drones or Hive.
Re Li'l Acc crawlers ( examine what the base tiles produce and maybe move a crawler ( next to the Nut crawler) onto it, then move the 'Nut' crawler into that forest and crawl mins. Might work.

Don't forget stockpile. Next turn maybe we can rush an impact.

Ok at Atlantis start Sea Colony pod I think.

Don't forget to send end save. Ta

[Makahlua]

http://apolyton.net/upload/files/Mak...dPEACE2154.SAV

Review and I'll post soon as I'm able tomorrow

[johndmuller]

I think it is unreasonable to expect that we could survive at Atlantis long enought to build a SeaColony Pod, and it also seems unlikely that we could get that transport to Calico (either at all, or soon enough to pick up the pod that will be ready next turn); we could probably build a new one nearly. So since we didn't get a free SeaColony Pod, I think our best chance would be to build an Inf Colony Pod at Atlantis and hope to take it away to the north (where the Hive refuge may hopfully be located) with the Transport that is already nearby before Atlantis gets sunk. (It might be wise to park the Transport beyond the base at Atlantis (rather thin in it) if we have to wait for the CP to finish so as to give it a slight chance of surviving any hostilities that might occur there.) In any case, would suggest getting the hell out of the neighborhood as quickly as possible.

[Hercules]

Agree

[FlameFlash]

I second that.

[Makahlua]

HMB's down now, a 4 unit Cycon force is at LA. a cruiser is approaching Calico so we got that CP off just in time. 35 PoE in the vault; we can rush the CP @ Atlantis and have it on the 'sport next turn. I've routed the nearest warship to cover it and the other near LA is sailing thru the Banana Sea to join it or divert pursuit.

[FlameFlash]

Join, but at a distance, that way it can divert pursuit if need be.

[Makahlua]

edit ; my bad, shall we try that again?

[Hercules]

Maki you haven't waited for feedback. There are still some further options available, so don't send the turn just yet.

For example changing the build at Calico to a buoy scout, rather than dock police. Also moving the schooners to strategic locations.

[Makahlua]

Latest mid turn can be found here :

http://apolyton.net/upload/files/Makahlua/mid2155-2.SAV

[Makahlua]

Don't forget, need any final suggestions by 4 hours from now; that'll be the 48 hour mark.

[Makahlua]

End turn available; followed Herc's email suggestions

http://apolyton.net/upload/files/Makahlua/end2155-2.zip

[Googlie]

Originally posted by Makahlua
edit ; my bad, shall we try that again?

Makahlua :

Can you send me the first 2155-mid sav that was deleted from this post in this thread?

Allegations of cheat reloads have been made regarding this turn and the only comment I can make to the accusing party (the CyCon) is that a midsave was posted then withdrawn, so can you furnish the missing save?

And it is regarding how a 2-2-1 hardened unit (your laser unit at LA) can defeat a 1-3-1 Disciplined one (the defensive unit in the CyCon attacking force)

I must admit to being concerned, as in 25 tries I cannot destroy the CyCon plasma unit with the PEACE laser unit so naturally I am suspicious of any different outcome - and when that particular turn had at least 2 reloads, one wonders ......................

Googlie

[johndmuller]

Talk about chutzpah - the Cycon accusing us of cheating!

Like the fine upstanding role models of honesty and integrity they have been in this game .

(Like the odds of their winning what seemed like the previous 10 or 15 straight, at least some against decent opposition, and with the base defense bonus to boot in most cases, are beyond question.)

Edit: As far as I can tell, the Cycon haven't even seen the results of our 2155 turn at this point - turn seems to still be with the PUT - how can they be questioning it?

[Googlie]

Originally posted by johndmuller

As far as I can tell, the Cycon haven't even seen the results of our 2155 turn at this point - turn seems to still be with the PUT - how can they be questioning it?

Remember that Archaic has devolved the PUT turnplaying to the CyCon, so they (CyCon) are now playing PUT's turns

And I have read your (JDM's) PM to Tass re the odds - I have now played that turn fifty times and never have been able to kill the plasma unit with the laser unit.

However, if I amend the alphax.txt to insert a 25% (or higher) elevation attacking bonus, then play the turn, I change the odds from 3:4 to a much better 72:64 - the laser unit survives and the rover can then polish off the 2 lightly defended units

Is it possible that some are playing with amended alphax.txt files (the default elevation bonus is 0%). Note that I am not saying that this might have been deliberate, I am just asking if perhaps an inadvertent change was left in place.

Otherwise I cannot see how the laser unit could defeat the plasma armor unit.

G.

[johndmuller]

First, my main reason for posting was that I found it really hard to believe that the Cycon would have the balls to complain about anyone else's ethics in this game.

Second, I was not particularly aware that the Cycon were playing the PUT turns - I thought that Tass had recruited GT to help Archaic - but given Archaic's recent difficulties, I'm not surprised - though I do find it strange that the powers that be would favor/permit such an arrangement (as it can't really be undone in the future given the way we pass the turns in the open).

Third, I didn't send any PM's to Tass regarding the odds (or any other matter).

Fourth, on the question of whether or not the the combat results of that battle were intentionally faked or were the result of reloads - I would have to say that would be a pretty serious (not to mention insulting) charge to levy; I for one am certain that Cap'n Maki is not a cheat.

On the question of whether her Alphax.txt was unknowingly adjusted in the fashion you describe, that would be for her to answer, but while it is of course possible for her to have innocently done something along those lines, it seems unlikely that she would both have modified it in the first place, and then gone ahead and used it in a PBEM in the second. I've done a bit of experimenting with the .txt files and I wasn't even sure that there was such an adjustment (for non artie combat) without looking it up.

I never really looked at this turn in question (but I think I probably will before this back and forth is done), but on the surface it seems less likely that you could go 50 tries without winning at 3 to 4 than that Cap'n Maki would happen to win on those odds in 1 try.

Your test sounds pretty convincing too, except it certainly belies the supposed odds - perhaps there is some quirk of the random number generator that is locking you into a subset of the possible outcomes - have you tried varying some of your sequence - like making some other attack first (if we have enough units to make that possible) to change up the randomization process, or moving something into fungus or whatever else might roll the random number dice an extra time?